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To Opera developers: please listen to the users.

  • I listened to paulmarkj and nod my head. I just posted "rubinontheroad" saying the same basic things that were never answered here. There is no "preferences after settings" even though all help and forum answers say there is. Settings in the dropdown of "Opera" leads to the same choices, first made upon starting with Opera, why is that so hard to understand. Help and forum help guide you to something that doesn't exist. I feel for paulmarkj and I've only been trying to change font size and set a menu bar. What no responses from someone who understands what we are seeing?

  • Your preferences are in settings, @rubinontheroad. You don't need a separate preferences setting. And because there are less settings in Opera 22 than there were in Opera Presto, it would make no sense to have a separate preferences file. It would be foolish consistency with what was. On the menu issue, just press the alt key (or alt f), and you can open the menu. It's one key (or two). If you use a qwerty keyboard, your hands are practically sitting on the alt key. On font size, press 0 or 9 (with the advanced settings in play). It's simple to set the font size.

    On the zoom feature, I found a Chrome extension you might like (if pressing the 0 or the 9 is too much work), and you prefer something other than using the keyboard shortcuts. See https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/zoom/lajondecmobodlejlcjllhojikagldgd?hl=en It gives you a scrolling bar, for zooming, and more. To download a Chrome Extension, you do need the Opera Extension, Download Chrome extension https://addons.opera.com/en/extensions/details/download-chrome-extension-9/?display=en Or Extension Source Viewer https://addons.opera.com/en/extensions/details/extension-source-viewer?display=en You can install this, and if you don't like it, uninstall.

    The resources for how to do the things you want, rubinontheroad, or to have totally simple workarounds, are out there.

  • I want to address your comment about science, art and technology's need to grow. Using a slightly older browser is not the equivalent of thinking the earth is flat. I appreciate the need for technology to keep moving, but the purpose of computing is (mostly) productivity. When programs change drastically, your productivity is cut into while you learn an what is an essentially new program. I chose not to learn Word's new ribbon and switched to the open-source Open Office, which rarely changes and is not subject to malware problems. I've been using the same version for 5 years and don't feel I'm missing anything. My version of PaintShopPro dates back to 2001, but it does what I need efficiently. I use maybe 10% of the functions anyway, and new bloated versions would be wasted on me.

    I belong to a large PC users' group in a major city. Most people, even in this group, use only a small percentage of the functions of large program. It's not necessary for developers to keep puffing up programs with thousands more lines of code, but they feel everything must be "new and improved," like soup, cookies and detergent. And of course pricier, which is the purpose of the whole thing. Hard drives and RAM have to get larger to accommodate all this, too, so what you have is constantly becoming obsolete. Win XP is an excellent OS, beloved by literally millions around the world, but MS has replaced it 3 times, 2 of which were disastrous. That's OK, they'll just make a Win 9 soon.

    Now let's take the example of free browsers. Bloating doesn't raise the price or the salaries of developers. I think they change the code because they can, not necessarily for the users' benefit. My primary browser, Firefox, just went through a drastic new GUI, along with some security fixes. I spend a great deal of time at Mozillazine.org, and scores of users found they couldn't work efficiently with the new GUI, couldn't find familiar things. But we had to update to get the new security features. Add-on developers soon wrote 2 extensions that restores the old features. Then we spent some time learning the new extensions. And now our profiles are a little bigger. And so it goes...

  • Things change in life so you'd better get used to it. What will you do should Open Office be removed? My wife is an office manager and for years used Word for program guides she developed. Then the local newspaper decided that they did not want to use MS Word so she was forced to use an entirely new program which she HAD to learn.

    Opera Presto is dead and that is that. A person would be a fool to continue to use Windows XP in today's hacker world but fools are all around us and continue to take chances. Presto was increasingly incompatible with many websites AND increasingly difficult of the programmers to maintain. Talking about the whys and wherefores of software changes is pointless: it is what it is so deal with it.

    Bottom line: either get used to the new Opera browser or find another than floats your boat but don't expect Opera to cater to your wishes. You paid nothing for Presto and you have no contract dispute or axe to grind with the company that provided so freely the software you used all those years.

    I LOVE the new browser and I know many others do as well. The number of whiners are beginning to shrink as more get on board with the new browser. Oh, there will always be whiners and complainers... that's a given. Opera needs to focus on developing the new browser and it is doing just that.

  • What has to be realized is that there are two "world-views" regarding web browsers. One view sees a good browser as an inherently highly-integrated tool to efficiently accomplish a user's work, which normally implies in that user view, a high degree of continuity in native browser controls and behavior - even as the tool design evolves. The other view sees a good browser as simply a convenient portal for rapid access to the Internet associated with mostly casual or unstructured purposes, wherein continuity and detail-level functional browser control are essentially non-entities. The latter view, which today increasingly includes browser designers, perceives that any user-sought, detail-level control/functionality can be readily accomplished by custom/third-party add-ons or extensions; and that view generally regards the limitations and problems of such adjuncts thereby imported into a user's browsing experience/performance to be either trivial or simply an unavoidable consequence of being a "minority" class of user today.

    Those of us users who have lived through much, if not all, of the evolution of computers and the Internet have seen this same kind of transition in all areas of the digital realm, both hardware and software. A very large part of it stems, of course, from the "commercialization" of computers and the Internet as they have been gradually adopted by very large numbers of non-technical users, as well as stemming from growing numbers of users who have never learned nor cared about the "innards" of detailed, subtle software features in order to improve the software's native usefulness (to themselves) as a tool. In that regard, it's just the way things currently are... designers are simply following the trend toward where the largest user market currently lives. Of course, that makes things more than a little problematic for "tool-focused" browser users, since the market is witnessing a growing evaporation of tool-based browser native functionality in favor of simplistic consumer-grade browsers with most tool-like features left to be bolted-on as needed by those users who require them.

    Only time will tell if there again arise future browsers that are more tool-like in their behavior. It almost certainly won't come from "free" browsers that are chasing the mass-market. In the meantime, tool-oriented browser users have to find their own way to a solution that works for them, depending on whatever the tradeoffs are between various existing browser concepts and how those impact them as users. For some, that will mean staying with Old Opera plus an adjunct browser for "difficult" sites; for others, it will mean trying New Opera and a host of extensions; for some others, it will require migration to an entirely new (to them) browser; and for still others, it will mean learning to use multiple browsers almost interchangeably, depending on the "tool-ish" needs of the moment. What is certain is that things have changed in major ways, and will probably change a lot more in the not-so-distant future as trends exert their pressure.

  • Leushino--

    I don't need my computers for work, so I can choose any programs that work for me. There will always be open-source programs for those Opera is my secondary browser. My first choice has been Firefox, since v.1, to which I've added many years of tweaks to the code and 30 add-ons. It's not just a tool but something I've honed to my own requirements. Opera will never compare to that browser for flexibility.

    I belong to maybe an elite group, a computer club where I've attended workshops for 18 years. The majority of people I know outside the club use their programs right out-of-the-box, but the 400,000 registered users at mozillazine.org certainly don't.

  • (Have you noticed you can't edit your posts here. Some software doesn't do enough.)

    typo above--, 2nd sentence
    There will always be open-source programs for those who don't want the bloat of commercial programs. Some software companies don't understand "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

    2nd Paragraph--there are far more power users than when I started computing, but there are also far more choices of programs performing the same functions. Users tend to level off at whatever works for them.

  • Have you noticed you can't edit your posts here

    Yes, you can. Up to 30 minutes after you have posted.

  • @newoperanut

    To edit your post, you refresh the page after you posted something, click on the cog underneath your avatar, and click on the edit button. You have 30 minutes after your post to edit. I know how frustrating it is not to be able to edit, so am glad the Opera forum makes it possible and easy.

    Now you say, Firefox is "not just a tool but something I've honed to my own requirements. Opera will never compare to that browser for flexibility." I also use Firefox, as a backup, and I have for years. However, I vastly prefer Opera 22. I know Firefox has more extensions, but Opera does have all of its own extensions, as well as Chrome extensions, so it does have quite a lot of flexibility. Now in my experience, Opera 22 is faster than Firefox. And some browser tests I've seen support that. http://www.slideshare.net/MID_AS/browser-performance-tests

    And then Opera has some other features -- like the wonderful Speed Dial with folders, Discover, Stash, turbo mode . . . I can see your long adherence to Firefox, but choosing the browser is not an open and shut affair. There is no black and white answer. I think the new Opera can compete for users with anyone.

    And while I'm on this topic of black and white, @blackbird71, your last post was a good one (as yours almost always are), though I wanted to blur a contrast that you made. You seemed to suggest two types of users -- one, the more business oriented (the one looking at the browser as a tool to accomplish work), and the other, perhaps, the more pleasure oriented, what you call, users looking for a "convenient portal for rapid access to the Internet associated with mostly casual or unstructured purposes." Many (maybe most) users have a mix of both in them. They use the browser for business purposes (in the workplace, on-line banking, for purchases, etc), but also for more casual uses -- in pursuit of hobbies, blogs, music, video, information needs. I do think the new Opera can be a good browser of choice for the business user (added functionality though with extensions), the casual user, and that other group (possibly the largest category), the user, who uses the browser for both business and casual needs.

  • @paulmarkj

    I look up "opera save session", the advice from opera.help.com says:
    Could you elaborate on how you looked that up? The contents on help.opera.com is basically Opera's help files, and they are different for different versions. The right way to reach the site is from the "Help" menu. If you searched the web and opened a page on help.opera.com without checking which version it applies to you will of course risk being misled.

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