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  • I agree with the "stop whining thing" because Opera now is different we can't do anything about that. However I found myself using Safari on my Mac instead of Opera because of the lack of many features I was used to like bookmarks and sync. So I'll stick with Safari for the time being keeping an eye on Opera Development. When the features I need most we'll be back I'll happily restore Opera as my default browser.

  • irony - whining about how other people whine

  • irony - whining about how other people whine


  • God... i hate it if people always complain about useless reasons!
    Instead of being sad that we have been losing nearly all customizability functions we users should be happy that we finally get a stock UI which is ALREADY optimized so that it is not necessary anymore to mess around until the perfect workflow is created.
    And not to forget, customization features are still bloat which slow down a program. People who want to have such an experience can customize over add-ons, which is the only valid way to do it.
    Seriously, how often do you customize your browser? every day? every week? Fact is you do it most of the time ONCE and then you ignore the features for very long time. So having such features in add-on form is the more preferred, more better way to handle tasks like that.
    Opera has just decided to bring us a competitive engine with the most possible workflow optimizations possible! And for that we should not be whining of what we have lost, we should embrace what we instead win!

    What may be optimized for you is useless for me.
    Plus, I want something as simple as 'Gesture left, Flip Back' to show me a menu of my recently closed tabs. How far away is that, 10 versions?

  • We are whining because we want Opera to be best browser. Till Opera 12 out of the box functionality was simply outstanding, plus you can do hell of the customization. After using Opera for nearly 15 years, I felt cheated, robbed and dumped by the Opera management.

    Since Opera 15 onwards, it has been a bloat and memory hogger. I am unable to understand how people are finding Opera Next optimized !

    Moreover I could not understand, why the team wants to build another chrome clone when so many are already available. Many of them are better than current versions of Opera.

    I am sorry to say that the management has pushed a self destruct button. It is a simple fact that and company, which tries to push their own ideas, rather than what the users wants, is doomed !

  • Opera has just decided to bring us a competitive engine with the most possible workflow optimizations possible!

    Opera has brought us yet another Chrome clone, with the same "competitive engine" that powers already about half a dozen other browsers.

    And for that we should not be whining of what we have lost, we should embrace what we instead win!

    We won something? You don't say…
    What features and functionality are there in Opera Blink that weren't already available in the Presto versions?

  • What features and functionality are there in Opera Blink that weren't already available in the Presto versions?

    • Stash
    • Tabs Hibernation
    • Lazy Session Load
    • Hung Plugin Monitor
    • And more

    Some are still experimental.

  • Why does this topic sound like defending 2-color icons to graphic artists (hello Windows 8)? From my understanding, OP should then be using Lynx, it's the most simplified interface I've ever seen.

    Speaking seriously though, if one wants a bare-minimalistic, KISS, noob-oriented browser, how many options do you need? 20? You've got that long ago. Now, echoing other users, what really gives Opera a clear edge over most of them? What makes it stand out?

    Now how many browsers are targeted to Internet power-users that know precisely what and why they're doing? I know only two: Opera 12.x and older, or extension-loaded, fully crapped-Firefox. Opera had been for long a reference for webdesigners that really understood HTML and CSS; it's gone for about a year, since Presto started lagging behind on both arenas, so I totally understand the choice of abandoning Presto and moving on to another engine.

    What I can't understand, though, is how they totally ignore what's their target audience. If I want a simple browser, there's a ton already there, even other generic Chromes - but I guess all have bookmarks, so it may be too complicated or cramped for the new Opera lovers. For historic Opera, though, many users are experienced dawgs who do stuff all other browsers don't handle properly - or simply not at all - and that is their "workflow". I, for one, am on it since Opera 5 was launched (still paid), and stay with 12.16 because I won't spread all my notes and bookmarks across hundreds of text files, synchronized via Dropbox (or insert-here-your-dream-sync-option). It's plain stupid.

    I may not customize my browser often, but I do it on every new computer in 5 minutes (and I change computers quite often), but I use those customizations EVERY DAY. Otherwise, I'd be using another browser. Why is it hard to understand? On opera 15, I gave up after 30 minutes trying to search a bunch of extensions that would give me similar functionalities. And my experience with another once-great software that opted to go stupid bare-simple, Thunderbird, is that for every version update I have to wait a few weeks before all my extensions get updated, so I admit I didn't even try it with Opera.

    So I perfectly understand how the new Opera is perfect for my granny's coiffeuse's workflow, or my 6yr nephew that only uses it for Facebook and web games, but for a technical user who's usually among 20+ tabs, 2 windows, and using 2-3 sessions per month, usually switching between tabs tens of times per day, it's much of a drag. And if I can't even sync notes and bookmarks between my desktops and notebooks (personal and professional) in a practical way - specially because there's no bookmarks anymore - then I have absolutely no use for this new browser, and that's why I stick with 12.16 even with its memory appetite and 4-5 crashes per day (don't mind, that's why auto-saved sessions and 8GB RAM exist).

    I actually wouldn't even mind the lack of Link, if I could at least sync only 3-4 .adr files (not hundreds) via Dropbox, Bluetooth, pen-drive, diskette, whatever; it's not that much work. But now I don't even have the option to it, and what some people don't seem to get is that Opera has always been precisely about options. I have the option to disable mouse gestures. I have the option to hit F4 and hide the sidebar. As well as I have the option to show a full status bar at the bottom. And I sure do all when I so wish, depending on my needs. As well as I can navigate (fast) through all of the darn pages and tabs without ever touching the mouse or screen via Shift-arrows, or whatever other key would fit me - if I really want to customize it. Taking that away is akin to abolishing extensions would be for Firefox users.

    Lastly, if Opera doesn't want to maintain Presto and it has a direct impact over the whole browser, as its interface is heavily based on its engine, there's still the option of making it open-source, even partially. You can still protect (by not disclosing) relevant parts of the code and even create your own license, it'd still be a lot better, more fair and surely less dangerous than neglecting all its user base. Or, at least, refrain from doing the big jump until you have a decent product to show - which, as I understand, is not yet the case. The way it is now, Opera will need to start entirely anew, attracting new users while dumping most of the old ones (which were never as many as IE or FF, but surely more loyal and not just a few), without even offering a clear differential over its competitors - which now include the likes of Maxthon simply because of lack of options.

    I, for one, am looking for a replacement. Repeating myself, my "best" option seems to be Firefox with at least 10 extensions, as much as it kind of terrifies me.

  • Just take an example of Windows 8. Microsoft removed the Start Button, with fancy Metro interface and see the user's outrage. That one over smart move by Microsoft has affected their sales and thus the revenue.

    Had Opera been a trialware / shareware, the company would have incurred huge losses by now.

  • Stash
    Tabs Hibernation
    Lazy Session Load
    Hung Plugin Monitor

    The Stash offers nothing you couldn't achieve just as well with bookmarks and sessions in Presto Opera, minus the screen shots.

    What is "Lazy Session Load" supposed to mean? Sessions as such don't exist anymore in Opera Blink. Currently open tabs can be saved only as a group of Speed Dial entries.

    Presto has the start-up options "Continue from last time" and "Continue from saved sessions". That's certainly no less useful than the 15+ setting "Open a specific page or set of pages".

    Individual processes for tabs - if that is what you call "tabs hibernation" - comes at the price of considerably increased RAM and CPU usage. Or do you mean pinned tabs? Presto Opera has them already.

    And more
    Not "more", but a whole lot less.

  • The NEW Opera is a much better product than 12.16, except for the missing features/functionality. Software companies never understand that you cannot take functionality out that Users use a lot (Like the missing toolbar in Windows 7 vs XP)

    I started using Opera Next a few months ago, and have gradually started to like it. Today I use it for about 90% of my work. I would give it a B+. It is definitely faster to load and unload, and to access web-pages and email, etc. I have not had any problems or crashes - as my Windows 7 x64 Notebook is setup like a TANK, and is totally up to date - without any garbage.

    STOP GRIPING about the Chrome Engine.

    Chrome Engine + ALL Opera Features = A GREAT PRODUCT.

    I still have 12.16, that I HAVE TO USE the remaining 10% of time - which is still slow.

    Things that I miss the most, and I am eagerly waiting for from the Opera Desktop Team are:

    1. The old Bookmarks - I have in excess of 8000+ bookmarks, as I am a technophile and a researcher,
    2. Old Tab Order, (saw it in experimental stuff, but do not want to mess with it - no time, no patience),
    3. An option similar to "Windows" to view the details of the open Tabs,
    4. The 'Key" icon to enter saved passwords - not so much, but do not like the lack of security without a "Master Password",
    5. RSS Feeds - can Opera make this into an extension, for those who need. I do not need the mail function - as I use web-based gmail,
    6. Synchronize still sucks big time - was never fixed in v12.xx, was working "sort of" in v11.xx. Everything used to work except Bookmarks.

    If Opera feels that Bookmarks and RSS feeds bloat the product they should release them as extensions - for users who NEED them.

    Other than that, I use a few extensions to get my job done. No other customizations.

  • Wanted to add one more item to my list of 6 above:

    Double click to close a Tab.

  • Hmmmmm... I stuck with Opera since the start and have been an advocate despite often having to resort to other browsers for certain site functionality. I love Opera. I haven't been whining and will let Opera go it's own way. I'll give this Opera Next a try but so far what I see is Chrome that retains the lack of compatibility of Opera. I still have to switch to Chrome, IE, Safari, or Firefox for certain sites.

    So, for loyalty and history, I'll keep watch over the company and try Opera Next as my primary browser. I fear that time will forget the magic that was Opera. I loved that browsing experience. That tab system still makes me smile.

  • Well, I do like the Opera Extension, "Download Chrome Extension." With it, you can use any extension in the Chrome store. Perhaps, a few missing customization features can be found there. I mean, the glass is either half empty 🙂 or it's half full. I'm starting to use Opera 20 more.

  • irony - whining about how other people whine


    And Opera 2x is a simplistic toy for simpletons. That's as clearly as I can put it.

    And after this highly-touted paradigm shift with the new rendering/script engine - Opera marketshare is still virtually invisible.

    Yep, that worked-out real good.

  • Opera marketshare is still virtually invisible. Yep, that worked-out real good.
    Yep, because the only point of the switch is to get a load of users. And of course, the prediction was the new Opera would take the crown of the market share table in less than a year.

  • New Opera UI is not an Opera UI. just put your left thumb up and cover the top left corner of the browser, BOOM!, its chrome! wait, its FF! there is no unique distinction. you could say the icons are different and such, but in truth it's the same. I don't see the point of using opera if chrome is opera big bro.

    To say that the new UI is optimized is BS. It's conformity. I am using latest opera next and try getting around my usually browsing, 80% of the time i was like "What!?", want to duplicate a site, i automatically move my mouse down then up, "What!?", found some ads intensive sites," hmm.. i need to open this link", right click context menu then "open", "what!?" there's no "open" menu? only got "open link in...". So technically i need to close previous tab each time to get to the links i need.

    To more personal customization, i always have my tab bar bottom. i rarely touch navigation bar at all, F8 to type in address, mouse gesture to navigate like a boss, you can even minimize/maximize that certain tabs || it's uses, i don't need to tell you, too many to count and the best part, just hold right click drag up then right release. If you want to login to any sites, already saved your login ID and passwords, just forward, don't need to find and click the login button. Bottom tab bar is way efficient, when you switched to other program and back to opera again, you always find you cursor cruising top bottom top again. It's not lazy it's efficiency, like mouse gesture is efficient, you can use navigation bar on the top, but mouse gesture there to navigate faster.

    My point, we need to whine. Whining is essential for progress. Even if opera turn a blind eye there will be other people who wants to bring back opera to it's original form, maybe through open source.

  • My point, we need to whine. Whining is essential for progress. Even if opera turn a blind eye there will be other people who wants to bring back opera to it's original form, maybe through open source.

    if you want to whine, fine, just do it, but you do not need to say like "the new browser sucks", say what you want in the new version. As you can see, it is taking time to the devs realese a update, maybe it will have big changes now

  • I must admit I never used a lot of the super customization. I prefer to have the faster minimalist browser, that will be better able to access sites, with much greater availability of extensions. And I do like some of the new features -- Speed Dial (with folders), Discover, Off Road Mode . . . But no one is wrong about this, EXCEPT 🙂 sidneyneto is right: it would be nice if people stopped trashing Opera blink, and just talked about what they would most like added to it (the top priorities for them) (let's be real). A free browser can't be everything for everyone. And some of the priority needs may be able to come with extensions. Why not? And it's more likely to show up in the Opera store, if Opera does well with Opera blink, and holds or increases its following. Undermining and trashing Opera in the forum discourages new users before they've really tried the browser. And some of these new users may not even have a need for the super customization -- are just looking for a fast, attractive browser, and may be discouraged by some of the flaming in the forum here, and then will look for a browser elsewhere. And a less viable Opera -- which loses people like that -- will be in less of a position (financially or otherwise) to add customization features. A browser succeeding in holding and/or increasing its market share may be able to do more.

  • Just for your information..

    What you call "whining" can be a constructive activity.

    It is perfectly alright to object to and complain about things you do not like.

    Then, when you have done that, sometimes the only choice is to talk away (stop using it).

    But there is no point in walking away before you have voiced your opinion.

    More to the point: I said in a different topic:

    Opera 12 is a Power Mac / Mac Pro.
    Opera 2x is a Mac Mini.

    When Apple introduced the Mac Mini, did they call it "Mac Pro version 20"? No, of course not. And you can still buy a Mac Pro, next to a Mac Mini.

    Point being that Opera Next and Opera Classic are two different products and deserve separate development, while using the same new rendering engine.

    Opera Classic can use a user interface overhaul too, by the way. But Opera Classic is a power tool.

    So what I'm saying is: instead of demanding power features for Opera Next, demand a revamp of Opera Classic.

    And demand that they stop using the same version system for two different products. Opera Next is not Opera Classic version 20!!!!!