So what is Opera's target audience now?
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alreadybanned last edited by
alreadybanned,
You must be talking about Firefox which received $1 billion from Google, in exchange for which Mozilla made Google the default search engine. Now there's an incestuous relationship. Now that's not "chump change" :))
http://dottech.org/25695/google-to-pay-mozilla-nearly-1-billion-to-stay-default-search-engine-in-firefox/
They all have deals to make money from what Google will pay. Why? Because if a browser's developer-owner doesn't raise some income, it can't exist -- at least off the earnings of the browser. Surely it would not be getting the money to pay for research and development to produce the browser product from users like you. These companies that make browsers offer the product to you free (and yet you would complain that they take money from Google? You want something akin to an immaculate conception. It just isn't real. It doesn't and can't happen that way. Either you as user pay for the browser, or the owner-developer has to raise money elsewhere. That lucrative relationship with Google doesn't make Firefox any less a competitor of Google's. The same as to Opera. Now I would think Opera receives something from Google (in connection with using the latter's search engine), but far less that Firefox got, because Opera's market share is so much smaller than Firefox's.I specifically said "They(Opera), like other browsers". And considering that the question was about Opera's revenue sources it seems rather defensive to bring up Firefox.
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alreadybanned last edited by
Does Opera get referrer fees for the (ad supported) sites linked to by Discover?
I had that thought, because to me Discover seems kind of pointless since the Yahoo's of the world, seemingly every internet provider and a zillion other "make us your homepage" sites already link to similar content with even more user customization. Why build it into the browser?That's a very good question. I too wondered on what basis items shown on the Discover page were selected outside of geography. I am not a fan "Discover" either and find it a waste of bandwidth and resources for it to connect to pages I generally have not interest in. Being a source of revenue for them would make sense but I haven't been able to find anything on the subject
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lem729 last edited by
I kind of like Discover myself. For me it's a plus -- a huge, near endless (changing daily) news feed, not unlike the RSS extensions people like (only this one provides so much more), covering 14 subject areas, 36 countries, multiple languages. And yes, I use Feedly AND Discover, as significant news sources with the Opera browser. And I enjoy Discover at least as much, go to it, maybe more, as it provides a great opportunity to learn something about other people, and what news items are important to them. I like to click the cogwheel in Discover and change the country. It's seeing the world with a different set of eyes, from another perspective. Also, I enjoy changing the language, to read about the world or the country in another language. I think this is the case where the name, "Discover," is well-apt, because if you read some of these links with a setting on different countries, it is exactly what I find takes place. And it's just one button, takes up so little of the browser's real estate. Now it wouldn't bother me if another user could take the button away in their browser if they didn't want it.
As for the income issue, I think it's essential to know about Firefox/Mozilla receiving $1,000,000,000 from Google, just to agree to make it the Default engine in Firefox, because it, at least, provides some context to the statement by alreadybanned, that Opera makes all that money from Google. The browsers -- Opera, Firefox, etc. -- are offered for free and the money to pay for developments costs, staff, etc, to build them has to come from somewhere.
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drewfx last edited by
The following from Opera's most recent quarterly report might help to answer the target audience question:
http://www.operasoftware.com/company/investors/finance
{quote]
Opera’s key operational priorities in 2014 include
continuing to (i) sign operator agreements for Opera’s
existing and new products and services, including the
Rocket Optimizer
solution; (ii) grow revenues and users
of Opera’s mobile consumer products, particularly on the
Android and iOS smartphone platforms, and expand usage
and monetization of Opera’s owned and operated
properties; (iii) increase revenue from Mobile Publishers
and Advertisers (Opera Publisher Partner members), by
expanding Opera’s demand-side advertising reach and
capabilities; (iv) grow Opera’s desktop user base,
particularly in Russia/CIS; and (v) increase Opera’s overall
profitability and margins.
[/quote] -
drewfx last edited by
More:
[quote]
Today, the vast majority of Opera´s desktop users are in
the Russia/CIS region and in the emerging markets. Opera
is particularly focused on growing users in regions where it
already has a strong base of users, such as Russia.
[/quote] -
lem729 last edited by
Interesting, drewfx. . They have a 40 percent revenue growth in 2014. (From 62 to 87 million in one year). Revenue for desktop, up 6 percent YoY. New Opera Mini coming for Ipad (that's interesting. They're not limiting Ipad to just their Coast browser.. For televisions connected to the internet, they claim they are "the leading distribution medium to deliver premium video content, including Opera Mediaworks’ technology to monetize content owners." Cost of goods sold went up 8.9 million to 16.1 million. Payroll and related expenses went up from 23.9 to 31.7 million. Profitability went up 18.4 million to 22.7. In terms of Coast for Opera, it's biggest in Russian, the US, and China.
All in all, it sounds like 2014 was a pretty good year. And they have a lot of endeavors going on, internationally. Far more than just Russia. Is it time to buy the stock?
No wonder Discover is in 20 languages. -
stng last edited by
BTW, Russia was one of the largest market of desktop-based Opera (when it approached up to ~30% market share in 2008/09)
Todays statistics (percentage in Opera browsers group):
Opera 12 - 52,95%
Opera 11 - 3,60%
=56.6%
Opera 21 - 24,5%
Opera 20 - 11,48%
=36%
Source: http://top.mail.ru/browsers?id=250&ago=1#sids=chrome,mob,firefox,opera,msie&percent=0
- Mail.ru is a second popular web-site in Russian segment.
The real Opera browser is still more popular than Opera's chromium's derivation in this region. Also, there is interesting fact that Yandexbrowser (yet another clone) is more popular than Opera Blink, but less popular than aging Presto.
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lem729 last edited by
On what is the market, an interesting interview on Chromium-Blink, the movement of Presto users to Blink with a focus on Opera TV.
http://www.operasoftware.com/blog/opera-products/chromiumblink-opera-tv
And something on the Opera TV browser, which brings the full world of browsing to your connected TV. It would seem that they have in mind long-term that this browser would be based on Chromium-Blink, not Presto.
http://www.operasoftware.com/products/tv-browser
That could be useful. I don't see that in the US on our Roku, Chromium, Apple TV products. Google TV tried to do that in a partnership, I think, with Sony (with a large keyboard) but it didn't take off.
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Deleted User last edited by
The real Opera browser is still more popular than Opera's chromium's derivation in this region. Also, there is interesting fact that Yandexbrowser (yet another clone) is more popular than Opera Blink, but less popular than aging Presto.
This statistic will not hold much longer as the so-called "real" Opera browser becomes slow, unwieldy, insecure, out-dated and incompatible with most websites. I would certainly be hesitant to use it much longer. Its days are definitely coming to an end. Time for "real" Opera lovers to move on to the new Opera or find another browser and cut the whining.
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lem729 last edited by
Also, there is interesting fact that Yandexbrowser (yet another clone) is more popular than Opera Blink,[in Russia] but less popular than aging Presto.>
But then again, Yandex uses the Blink layout engine and is based on the Chromium open source project. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yandex_Browser)If you add up the two blinkist camps
they, perhaps, surpass the Prestoists -- even in Russia. -
drewfx last edited by
Interesting, drewfx. . They have a 40 percent revenue growth in 2014. (From 62 to 87 million in one year). Revenue for desktop, up 6 percent YoY.
Revenue for desktop is up, but not for the reason we might hope:
[quote]
In March 2014, the number of Desktop users was
approximately 51 million, down 7% versus 1Q13. Revenue
was up 6% in the 1Q14 compared to 1Q13, with lower
search revenue offset by higher licensing revenue,
including the licensing of the Rocket Optimizer
video/media optimization technology to a major Internet
company.
[/quote] -
lem729 last edited by
Well, one wouldn't expect an increase when PC sales drop 8 percent world-wide as consumers move to tablets. http://www.vg247.com/2013/10/10/pc-hardware-sales-drop-worldwide-as-tablets-continue-to-rise-report-finds/
That's the reason Opera has diverted energy into the mobile and tablet market, as, I would guess, have its competitors. What's important is the higher revenue figure keeping the activity financially stable. . . For first quarter, 2014, Opera says in their latest report, as regards desktop consumers, "in line with expectations." For the last three quarters -- from 3rd quarter 2013, to 1st quarter 2014 -- the desktop user figure is stable at 51 million.
Two of Opera's four revenue growth drivers are Mobile consumers, and Desktop users and usage. So I think the desktop browser is still important to Opera's plans, though obviously the mobile market is also.
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funksoulbro last edited by
Its target audience doesn't seem to be anyone in particular. Chropera is just Chrome with fewer features. That's why the only people here saying how awesome it is are the same 3 or 4 fanboys who say that in every thread like this one - and there have been tons of those. That's probably why it's progressed so slowly - absolutely nothing of value has been added to it in 12 months. Not one thing. I expect them to announce that they're discontinuing it soon. It's a complete waste of time and resources and their desktop market share is shrinking and will continue to do so.
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Deleted User last edited by
It's a complete waste of time and resources and their desktop market share is shrinking and will continue to do so.
It is a waste of time and resources develop something not compatible with new technologies, with a bunch of features that is not everyone who uses. Why Chrome is the most used if it does not have a single feature that Presto has? Because it more SIMPLE to use it!
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Deleted User last edited by
Its target audience doesn't seem to be anyone in particular. Chropera is just Chrome with fewer features. That's why the only people here saying how awesome it is are the same 3 or 4 fanboys who say that in every thread like this one - and there have been tons of those. That's probably why it's progressed so slowly - absolutely nothing of value has been added to it in 12 months. Not one thing. I expect them to announce that they're discontinuing it soon. It's a complete waste of time and resources and their desktop market share is shrinking and will continue to do so.
funksoulbro: Just go away. Find a browser you like and stop trying to undermine this forum.
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drewfx last edited by
I'm not a fan of the direction things seem to be going in, but actually it's not a waste of time for them as long as the desktop revenues exceed the costs of development/support/etc.
And given that they are essentially building on top of an existing engine, those costs may not pressure the revenue for quite some time, even with declining desktop revenue.
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alreadybanned last edited by
Interesting, drewfx. . They have a 40 percent revenue growth in 2014. (From 62 to 87 million in one year). Revenue for desktop, up 6 percent YoY.
Revenue for desktop is up, but not for the reason we might hope:
[quote]
In March 2014, the number of Desktop users was
approximately 51 million, down 7% versus 1Q13. Revenue
was up 6% in the 1Q14 compared to 1Q13, with lower
search revenue offset by higher licensing revenue,
including the licensing of the Rocket Optimizer
video/media optimization technology to a major Internet
company.
[/quote]Yep, posted similar stats myself only to be met with the usual rhetoric.
@lem729
I agree that mobile is where Opera is moving towards but the way they are going about it is all wrong in my opinion. They are essentially looking for new fish in a sea they never could swim in and doing so by running the risk of losing many of it's core users. Opera should realize their situation of being a niche browser and work towards appeasing their niche market while seeking other avenues for income generation. This of course would be a slower and more deliberate approach and one those who think in quarterly terms would not want to hear. Actually, Jon said something to that affect if I remember correctly. -
blackbird71 last edited by... I agree that mobile is where Opera is moving towards but the way they are going about it is all wrong in my opinion. They are essentially looking for new fish in a sea they never could swim in and doing so by running the risk of losing many of it's core users. Opera should realize their situation of being a niche browser and work towards appeasing their niche market while seeking other avenues for income generation. This of course would be a slower and more deliberate approach and one those who think in quarterly terms would not want to hear. Actually, Jon said something to that affect if I remember correctly.
Meaning no disrespect, but your, mine, Jon's, nor any number of other users' opinions simply don't matter regarding whether Opera is right or wrong in what they're going about doing. What matters is the opinion of that portion of the stockholders who vote to determine the composition of Opera ASA's board of directors, and the opinions of that board as interpreted by company management and its development staff. The stockholders are the ones with skin in the game, and they determine the course of the company via which directorate and management teams are put in place based on their votes... whether those stockholders correctly grasp the nuances of the "business" or not when voting. The rest of us are simply bystanders whose opinions are worth exactly the value of those electrons inconvenienced by posting them, whether those opinions turn out to be right or wrong.
The sad reality is that there are not a lot of determinative privileges and perks that come with using a free web browser, no matter who creates it or in what direction they carry the design.
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A Former User last edited by
@blackbird71 you exaggerate too much with that "pleasing stockholders" talk...
Some thoughts: if the stockholders want Opera to grow and get more revenue, they of course want Opera to get more users, and to have more users and keep them Opera must please them (the users). Also, some Opera employees are also stockholders...
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alreadybanned last edited by
... I agree that mobile is where Opera is moving towards but the way they are going about it is all wrong in my opinion. They are essentially looking for new fish in a sea they never could swim in and doing so by running the risk of losing many of it's core users. Opera should realize their situation of being a niche browser and work towards appeasing their niche market while seeking other avenues for income generation. This of course would be a slower and more deliberate approach and one those who think in quarterly terms would not want to hear. Actually, Jon said something to that affect if I remember correctly.
Meaning no disrespect, but your, mine, Jon's, nor any number of other users' opinions simply don't matter regarding whether Opera is right or wrong in what they're going about doing. What matters is the opinion of that portion of the stockholders who vote to determine the composition of Opera ASA's board of directors, and the opinions of that board as interpreted by company management and its development staff. The stockholders are the ones with skin in the game, and they determine the course of the company via which directorate and management teams are put in place based on their votes... whether those stockholders correctly grasp the nuances of the "business" or not when voting. The rest of us are simply bystanders whose opinions are worth exactly the value of those electrons inconvenienced by posting them, whether those opinions turn out to be right or wrong.
The sad reality is that there are not a lot of determinative privileges and perks that come with using a free web browser, no matter who creates it or in what direction they carry the design.None taken, I agree with you.
