Where do Opera 12.16 users go now Opera is dead?
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Deleted User last edited by
W-h-a-t-e-v-e-r. Opera will be just fine without a host of whiners. The truth is, it's growing whether you want to accept that fact or not. Customizability and unique features are being returned. The new browser is a complete rewrite from the ground up. Use an older version until such time as the new browser suits your requirements. In the meantime, relax. Life is good.
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serious last edited by
Originally posted by leushino:
Opera will be just fine without a host of whiners.
same goes for trolls ... just saying...
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frenzie last edited by
Originally posted by Luxor:
Originally posted by LeoCG:
The majority of Opera's user base will keep using Opera.
That is an opinion thus has no credence.
If Opera gets the import of old settings (e.g. keyboard bindings, search engines, etc.) and features (e.g. UserJS) down a bit better than it is now, it might just be the least amount of effort to switch to Opera even if e.g. Firefox might ultimately be a slightly better experience overall.
Of course if they don't improve migration, all bets are off. I think bookmarks, search engines, and possibly speed dials are probably the most important.
Originally posted by serious:
same goes for trolls ... just saying...
:lol:
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Deleted User last edited by
Originally posted by serious:
Originally posted by leushino:
Opera will be just fine without a host of whiners.
same goes for trolls ... just saying...
You know... the word "troll" has become a ubiquitous one. Everyone makes use it of to label those with whom they happen to disagree. I'm a troll in your eyes because I defend Opera's decisions in addition to holding a mirror up to the eyes of those who threaten to abandon it for some other browser. If that helps you keep your little world nice and orderly... putting me in my little niche and so-and-so in his, then by all means: I'm a troll. You on the other hand have nothing more than valid things to say and have never trolled the Opera forums. Tell you what Mr. Serious who won't even use his name. I'm going to place you on Ignore and I would urge you to do the same in regard to me. And I'm sure that Opera will take no notice of either of us. :whistle:
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j4jasbir last edited by
Originally posted by serious:
Originally posted by leushino:
Opera will be just fine without a host of whiners.
same goes for trolls ... just saying...
:lol:
Opera has lost its identity and now it identifies itself as chrome. There are now three main browsers left IE,firefox and chrome(all others are clones of these three and you can find hybrids also :p )
Where do Opera 12.16 users go now Opera is dead
I cannot find any alternative to Opera 12, so currently using Opera 12.6 and waiting to try that final version of new opera when the devs say that almost all Opera 12 features has been added and then finally decide whether to stick with new opera or change to Firefox.
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stng last edited by
j4jasbir
version of new opera when the devs say that almost all Opera 12 features has been added
When they said that what you mentioned about? I've read only about opposite plans from devs.
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j4jasbir last edited by
Originally posted by STNG:
j4jasbir
version of new opera when the devs say that almost all Opera 12 features has been added
When they said that what you mentioned about? I've read only about opposite plans from devs.
Please see below link
http://my.opera.com/desktopteam/blog/2013/07/02/opera-15We have neither asked nor forced our 12.x users to upgrade to Opera 15, as we know that some features that are important to you are still to come. So, while you are very welcome to test and use Opera 15, Opera 12.x will still be alive for some time. You can expect that we will keep Opera 12.x up to date and secure. In the future, once we are comfortable with the feature set, we may ask you to upgrade
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stng last edited by
Originally posted by j4jasbir:
[
We have neither asked nor forced our 12.x users to upgrade to Opera 15, as we know that some features that are important to you are still to come. So, while you are very welcome to test and use Opera 15, Opera 12.x will still be alive for some time. You can expect that we will keep Opera 12.x up to date and secure. In the future, once we are comfortable with the feature set, we may ask you to upgradeThere is clearly no indication that "almost all" of 12.xx's features should be restored in Opera/Blink.
Also, they mentioned about future of the Opera(Blink) earlier: "it won't be a clone of Opera 12" and "...over the years, Presto-based Opera had become overloaded with features, a number of them confusing rather than helping our users" (source: desktop team blog). -
staiger last edited by
Originally posted by misteromar:
I have used Opera since the shareware days but the new versions of Opera are trash, just other browsers rebadged and lack all the things that made Opera great.
I was wondering where the majority of Opera's user base will be migrating too? What are the commonly accepted best replacements?
I really like the idea of changing to a new rendering engine. Presto is hopeless for things like printing, copying page content to other documents, etc. And I think Opera are quite right to decide it's a waste of their time maintaining their own, unique rendering engine.
So, I'm keen to move over to the new Opera. BUT, the loss of those key features that made Opera so very special is a showstopper for me. The latest beta build isn't even close to 12.16 for features. Therefore I looked at all the other major browsers, hoping to find one with a better rendering engine (proper printing, copy/paste, etc) combined with most of Opera's key UI features that I cannot live without.
It can't be done! The only way to get close to replicating 12.16 is to use 12.16, and that means you're stuck with Presto. The closest I've got so far is Firefox laden with various extensions, but it still isn't close enough. Have you tried getting a decent Speed Dial that actually works with the latest version of FF and doesn't break the Tab Mix Plus extension that you also need to make FF usable? It's a nightmare!
So, it looks like my dream of keeping Opera features but with a better rendering engine are dead. Right now it's a toss-up between FF (better printing, copy/paste, etc, but clunky UI) and Opera 12.16 (crap printing and copy/paste, perfect UI).
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leocg Moderator Volunteer last edited by
Originally posted by STNG:
There is clearly no indication that "almost all" of 12.xx's features should be restored in Opera/Blink.
Also, they mentioned about future of the Opera(Blink) earlier: "it won't be a clone of Opera 12" and "...over the years, Presto-based Opera had become overloaded with features, a number of them confusing rather than helping our users" (source: desktop team blog).Yep, Opera Blink will not be a clone of Opera Presto with a new engine and this was an excellent decision they made.
Better having an Opera with less but useful for (almost) all people features than one with lots of features that 99% of people really don't need.
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j4jasbir last edited by
Originally posted by STNG:
There is clearly no indication that "almost all" of 12.xx's features should be restored in Opera/Blink.
Also, they mentioned about future of the Opera(Blink) earlier: "it won't be a clone of Opera 12" and "...over the years, Presto-based Opera had become overloaded with features, a number of them confusing rather than helping our users" (source: desktop team blog).I bookmarked a blog post on which all features of Opera 12 that are included,till not included as well as removed in new opera were mentioned but deleted later.Anyway in the new opera, I will be looking for the most important features that I used and from them mail and notes are gone.
At present there is nothing left in this new opera which makes it different from other browsers except speed dial.(maxthon has much better speed dial than opera and has an inbuilt video download feature called resource sniffer) And I am not fan of browser being fast as browsers are not made for F1 racing :p -
staiger last edited by
Originally posted by LeoCG:
Better having an Opera with less but useful for (almost) all people features than one with lots of features that 99% of people really don't need.
Why's that, then? I mean, the thing that differentiates Opera from all the rest are the innovative features it has introduced. It got several million users BECAUSE it was so different, not DESPITE that. In my opinion nobody is going to use, or switch to, Opera UNLESS it can offer something different.
As has been said loads of times already, if you remove those unique features you simply end up with a Chrome clone. What would be the point?
Of course, I'm not suggesting that Opera should clone every single feature of O12 in their new browser. But - speaking only for myself - there are many features that are really difficult to duplicate in any other browser, to the extent that I'm not interested in the new Opera until it meets my minimum list of O12 features.
Basically, in a crowded desktop browser market there seems little chance of Opera picking up a substantial number of new users. Therefore I think they should put much more emphasis on implementing those unique features that make Opera so attractive to its EXISTING users. If they don't do that, there would seem to be a big risk of losing existing users and not gaining any new ones.
I would be MUCH more inclined to stick with Opera if they gave us a much clearer roadmap of what features they intend to implement, and when. That way I'd have something to look forward to. At the moment they have told us almost nothing. In the absence of any information, people are going to drift away.
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Deleted User last edited by
But here's the thing. Your opinion is just that: YOUR opinion which I do not share, many others do not share AND most importantly, Opera does not share. Opera is actually growing as we speak. And as the new browser develops, it will definitely attract new users. The old Opera never grew beyond 3% and that was unacceptable to the shareholders. These are the men and women who have a financial investment in Opera... not the users like you and a few others who demand this and that but haven't put a dime into the operation.
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staiger last edited by
Originally posted by leushino:
Your opinion is just that: YOUR opinion which I do not share, many others do not share AND most importantly, Opera does not share.
OF COURSE it's just my opinion!! And it's just as good as any other user's opinion, and I am exercising my right to express it, just as you express yours.
And your point was?
Originally posted by leushino:
Opera is actually growing as we speak.
On the desktop?
Originally posted by leushino:
......the shareholders. These are the men and women who have a financial investment in Opera... not the users like you and a few others who demand this and that but haven't put a dime into the operation.
Hah! I was using Opera before you'd ever heard of it, back in the days when we DID pay for it!
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Deleted User last edited by
My point is simple. You stated: "In my opinion nobody is going to use, or switch to, Opera UNLESS it can offer something different." I counter with: balderdash. That's nothing more than a personal opinion and frankly there are absolutely no facts to support it. An opinion based upon feelings is relatively useless. That's my point.
Additionally: yes, you have a right to state your opinion. You have a right to make the claim that you are the re-incarnation of the last tsar of Russia but that doesn't make it so. You have the right to state that nobody is going to use or switch to Opera UNLESS it can offer something different but again... that doesn't make it so. Opera is NOT a Chrome clone. It is a browser in development. Features will be added back over time. We're on the front end of this development, so to speak. If the browser at this juncture doesn't cut it for you, then use v.12. If that no longer works well enough for you, then use some other browser. But don't try and make the case that the unfinished browser is not going to succeed because it lacks features and is currently not different enough to make others want to switch. Time will tell the tale. It's too early to make predictions of failure and from the little that has been reported, it appears that success is closer to the mark.
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by Staiger:
As has been said loads of times already, if you remove those unique features you simply end up with a Chrome clone. What would be the point?
Well, it is not a Chrome Clone, and won't end up as one.
Originally posted by Staiger:
Of course, I'm not suggesting that Opera should clone every single feature of O12 in their new browser. But - speaking only for myself - there are many features that are really difficult to duplicate in any other browser, to the extent that I'm not interested in the new Opera until it meets my minimum list of O12 features.
No doubt everyone else has their own set of "essential" feature, just as you and I do. I shall just keep using Opera 11.64 until the features I need are available in Opera Next.
Originally posted by Staiger:
If they don't do that, there would seem to be a big risk of losing existing users and not gaining any new ones.
They will lose some users, but they will gain more new users, which is why they made the leap to a Webkit/Blink based version. Whether we like it or not, they will implement the features that most users need, not what you or I need. If existing users are unwilling to adapt, they are sure to be disappointed, because they won't find all of Opera's unique features in other browsers either.
There are several comments in various blog posts about the roadmap. Just keep using the version that you like, and follow the Desktip Team Bllog or try out Opera Next and Opera Developer versions if you want.
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Deleted User last edited by
Originally posted by Pesala:
They will lose some users, but they will gain more new users, which is why they made the leap to a Webkit/Blink based version. Whether we like it or not, they will implement the features that most users need, not what you or I need. If existing users are unwilling to adapt, they are sure to be disappointed, because they won't find all of Opera's unique features in other browsers either.
There are several comments in various blog posts about the roadmap. Just keep using the version that you like, and follow the Desktip Team Bllog or try out Opera Next and Opera Developer versions if you want.
This is by far the best (and most succinct) advice I've read on these forum threads in months. Actually, it opened my stubborn eyes as well.
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sorin0306 last edited by
I agree with Staiger
You, (opera developer) are going on wrong way
Yes Opera 16 is much faster than Opera 12 but ...
When I first try Opera 16 it seems like a dejavu of Chrome
For me now Opera = Chrome
But considering the advantages of chrome like built in translation, more supported browser, and other features I chose Chrome
I use Opera from 9 years, I'm very disappointed now. -
leocg Moderator Volunteer last edited by
Originally posted by Staiger:
Why's that, then? I mean, the thing that differentiates Opera from all the rest are the innovative features it has introduced. It got several million users BECAUSE it was so different, not DESPITE that. In my opinion nobody is going to use, or switch to, Opera UNLESS it can offer something different.
Opera Blink will have some of the Opera Presto features - the useful for (almost) everyone as i said - and many othe new an unique features. Besides that, it will (re)gain users just because of the fact that it now renders pages better, including some of the most popular ones.
Surely some Opera Presto users will not move to Opera Blink because of the lost of their pet features but Opera (Blink) will gain new users.
Originally posted by Staiger:
As has been said loads of times already, if you remove those unique features you simply end up with a Chrome clone. What would be the point?
Opera Blink is not and never was a Chrome clone. Not even the UI is the same.
Originally posted by Staiger:
Of course, I'm not suggesting that Opera should clone every single feature of O12 in their new browser. But - speaking only for myself - there are many features that are really difficult to duplicate in any other browser, to the extent that I'm not interested in the new Opera until it meets my minimum list of O12 features.
I miss a few features of Opera Presto (Opera 12.16) but i've also noticed that i can live without many other ones.
Originally posted by Staiger:
I would be MUCH more inclined to stick with Opera if they gave us a much clearer roadmap of what features they intend to implement, and when. That way I'd have something to look forward to. At the moment they have told us almost nothing. In the absence of any information, people are going to drift away.
The are talking about what they are working on now than in the last 15 years. Developers are answering peoples question in a way a rarely have seen before.
The problem of a public roadmap is that, unfortunally, most users can't deal with the fact that things can change and so the roadmap can change.
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al-khwarizmi last edited by
Responding to the OP (ignoring the flamewar).
I'm still using 12.16, but for the sites where it doesn't work, I have tried several browsers and the least bad I could find is Firefox.
It doesn't have the customizability of Opera, but at least it does have some basic settings, and it supports the classic menu bar which is an important feature for me. So that's where I'm probably going to migrate when web standards change and 12.16 becomes unusable, although I'll always keep an eye on Opera Developer in case it finally gets good enough to convince me to use it.
