The impending demise of Opera?
-
lem729 last edited by
@werewold
The side panels have a nice aesthetic look, and give you a pleasing vertical layout of bookmarks. Perhaps, the panels slow the brower down. Or take a lot of complex programming. I'm a bit of an ignoramus there, ;))) I do think that if they could be done easily and without impairing browser performance, we'd have them In Opera Blink. But an improvement in the extension ability to do this is likely because there is demand. I think the new paradign for Opera is to keep browser lean and fast and rely on developers to give extensions for the rest.
Still, all may not be lost.
for a short term adjustment, waiting for . . . .( as for Godot, haha the sidebar), you can a nice vertical layout of bookmarks (but you do need to click on a toolbar icon for the extension to get that vertical layout, if you use something like Chrookmarks or Tidy Bookmars) (from the Chrome store), and there are other possibilities there that I haven't checked out. I like Chrookmarks because you can order it either chronologically or alphabetically, it sets out folders first, and makes them easy to manage. One makes adjustments . . . Not everything is as before (change involves initially pluses and minuses), but it can be liveable on the way to . . . why, (like Godot) . . . everything is coming up roses. A song. Lol. -
wfheller last edited by
I have been using Opera since Windows 3.1 and I had to pay for it. I have also payed for versions 4, 5, 6 until it became free with version 7. That is why I hate the chromium version since opera 15. I have currently version 20 on my laptop but rarely use it because it is just a Chrome clone but one without bookmarks and no mouse gestures that can compare with versio 12.16 which is my standard browser. I hve transported my bookmarks to Firefox and Safari and even IE with Transmute.
But i hpoe that in the near future the guys in norway have seen their error and make an Opera with bookmarks and complete mouse gestures including the ability to redefine most used commands to one letter abreveations. I think that jrista is absolutely right in his complaint and I agree with it 100%. -
wfheller last edited by
Using the Microsoft Internals program Process Explorer I find that both Chrome and Opera20 use a gigantic amount of storage both working set and private bytes - they add up to about 3 times the size of Opera12.16. And why is it necesary to start 8 subthreaths when Opera12 uses only one for the plugin-wrapper.
-
berng last edited by
I have been using Opera since Windows 3.1 and I had to pay for it. I have also payed for versions 4, 5, 6 until it became free with version 7. That is why I hate the chromium version since opera 15.
I really don't understand what paying for very early versions of Opera (4,5,6) has to do with hating Chromium versions.
-
lem729 last edited by
@wheller.
Opera 20 is absolutely not a browser without bookmarks. Where do you come up with something like that. I mean if people repeat something over and over again, it does not make it true. It's nonsense. Absolute, and total. Opera 20 has tons and tons of bookmarking -- from in the Speed Dial (with folders), to the Personal bookmarks toolbar to, Stash to bookmarking extensions in both the Opera and Chrome extension stores. It has more bookmarking possibilities than probably any browser on the market, and cerainly more than IE, Firefox, and Chrome (all of which I have on my computer and tested). I'll take Opera 20 for bookmarking any day. I can listen to and understand other gripes, but this one is beyond ridiculous,
-
lem729 last edited by
Isn't Opera for everyone who has tried Chrome and finds fault? Chome is a joke and example of Open Source failure. It freezes my 8 gig ram, quad core machine...Contantly!
The cache is NOT controllable. The rendering is slow. It takes chrome 2 minutes to initialize. Everything done poorly.
Opera, oth, has had some bad versions. But on whole is much more of a rock. Not as dumbed down as Chrome. Open source loves to rip out features and improvements for a the stupidest user base.You have a point. :))) I have a strange situation, where I hardly use Chrome, I use Opera 20, but I get messages on my computer (from my Norton software) every now and then of huge CPU use (95 percent on one CPU or something like that) coming from the Chrome browser. I haven't even opened the browser on my computer. Now I did have a check in my settings there -- "continue running background apps when Google Chrome is closed." I don't know what those background apps are, but they sure have been running my computer into the ground. I have taken the check out. What kind of background apps could eat up so much of my CPU. Hopefully taking the check out, will solve the problem. If I still get the CPU messages, I may have to uninstall Chrome.
-
werewolf last edited by
Lem729 -
Again -
I just want a bookmark panel that STAYS OPEN on the left side of my screen, like Opera 12 and previous had, and like Firefox still has.
So that I can click on any one of my numerous bookmarks easily with one step.
Is this option so difficult to achieve with Chrome type browsers? It was available for many years on just about all of the earlier browsers.
-
wfheller last edited by
lem729
I have about 2600 bookmarks [give or take a hundred] in 17 directories in Opera12 - that is converted to speeddial that takes longer to load than Opera20 itself. That is why I want de normal bookmarks back.
-
lem729 last edited by
I deal with your bookmarks in the second, third and fourth paragraphs, but in my humble opinion, don't put the vast bulk of them in the speed dial;). 2600! Ughhh. The speed dial can hold them, but I'd hate to clutter it with too much. And I think all of the thumbnails - so many -- may slow it down, even loading from cache. For the Speed dial, it's super to emphasize some of your best that you go to all the time. I have maybe twelve folders (up to ten things in a folder, sometimes less, and 10 indivdual items, not in folders. It only takes up half the page of my speed dial. In one folder i have a lot of music -- Pandora, Slacker, Tunein Radio, etc. In another I have video and TV sites -- YouTube, DailyMotion.Com, etc. In a third, General News with many ten items in it, Another folder for Sports, etcetera. (But still, my Speed Dial holds a lot more for a display (and very easy access) without destroying the wallpaper/background, than I could ever do with a traditional Speed Dial without folders). Each to his own, but let me urge you not to use so much of the Speed Dial that you make it ugly. Make the speed dial beautiful. Give it great wallpaper (which you can personalize by using your own jpgs from your computer if you choose) and use some of the Opera themes. You can also right click jpgs on the internet, and turn them immediately into wallpaper. The Speed Dial is your home page. A home, you make beautiful. I even adjust the number of columns I'm using whenever I put in new wallpaper, so as not to block nice things in the Speed Dial. I sometimes use four columns, sometimes 6 or 7 for the Speed Dial. Now of course, you can do what you did, but I think it would be bad :(( so I understand your telling me that it is. Think about, for you, wfheller, the things you go to the most often!!! Emphasize them with Speed Dial inclusion. Surely ;))))) you don't go to 2600 bookmarks equally and all the time.
Now for the important part. Put the mass of bookmarks in the Personal Bookmarks toolbar. It can make normal bookmarks. Lol. Make sure in Settings, Browser, etc. you activated it. It will go across the top of the browser toolbar, and when it reaches the end, moves down vertically. I think there's room, because at the end it moves down vertically. Because you have so many bookmarks, you need to play with your folders a little, maybe. But it should be able to make folders within folders, so I think you can organize, and it would be much better than on the speed dial. You can click on an empty space in the toolbar to create a new folder. You need to know how to make new bookmarks on the toolbar -- dragging the icon (?) of the website -- all the way to the left of the address bar -- to the personal toolbar, or dragging a link from the Speed Dial to the personal toolbar.
By the way there's no limit to what you can put in Stash. Someone told me they had 1000 bookmarks there. There's a search engine that can go through it. I want to explore myself making better the use of it -- at least the right use for me. Though I would emphasize for the vast bulk of your bookmarks, the Personal Bookmarks toolbar (which is also a more traditional display). I think it will work for you.
Also before you do the bulk of your organzing, download a bookmarks manager extension. I use Chrookmarks for Chrome. There are others that are possible too. Tidy Bookmarks for Chrome is reasonable. (There may be one called Pretty Bookmarks? that some people tout). To get a Chrome extension, you need to download the Opera extension, "Download Chrome Extension", and then you should be good to go ;)))) And good luck!!!!!
-
lem729 last edited by
@wheller
On organizing your bookmarks into folders, I have the extension Chrookmarks for Chrome, and it works well for me.
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/chrookmarks-chrome-bookma/kcdheengilgkagjehknnnofigbmlnnfj?hl=enIf you click on the Chrookmarks icon on the Personal toolbar, you get a vertical display of your bookmarks. If you right click on a folder, you get the option to make a new folder. If you right click on that new folder, you get a vertical option to create inside it a new folder, and on and on. Now those folders that you create show up on Personal Bookmarks bar (that you no doubt activated by going to Settings/Browser, and put a dot in the place to activate it).
Without Chrookmarks, if you right click on a folder in the personal bookmarks bar, you don't get that option to create a folder in the folder (which is a bit of a nit/flaw) (only redeemed because of the extension.. I'm not saying Chrookmarks is the only Bookmarks manager extension that gives you the ability to create folders within folders, but it's the only one I have on my computer to test right now. Since you have 2400 bookmarks, the ability to create folders within folders is essential. What I'm saying is that you can do it.
-
wfheller last edited by
So I will have to cleanup in the bookmarks I collected over the last 20 years and probably there are a lot non existent today.
But the other problem remains that the number of mouse-gestures are decreased and I cannot assign one letter commands to existing commands that require either Ctr or Alt. I am a keyboard user for fast browsing [besides: the mouse requires extra coding and therefore cpu cycles compared to the keyboard - the keyboard is driven in the IOS but the mouse requires a driver]. A very nasty omission is the Opera-Link. I use the Operausb version when I help the less digital knowledgeable persons so that I can start Opera without having to use the person's own browser. With Opera-Link I can quickly get all my setting and passwords without having to type them while others are looking on. But I will continue to test new versions when they come available - I am having a look at Opera Next to see when I can change my default browser from Opera12.17 to Opera2x, -
lem729 last edited by
If you mean, when you say that you are a keyboard user, that you prefer it to the Mouse,you might want to look at for Opera 20 the Chrome extension Vimium
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/vimium/dbepggeogbaibhgnhhndojpepiihcmeb?hl=en
which provides for a lot of keyboard browsing -- configuring keys etc. I downloaded and looked at it, but didn't keep it, because I use the mouse more, but it was cited to me by another in the forum and looks like it might be promising for people who like to do most everything with the keyboard. (If you download an extension, and you don't like it, it's easy enough to uninstall).
Now to Download a Chrome extension in Opera 20, you do need the Opera extension, "Download Chrome Extension."
Also, don't get rid of Opera 12.16.
At a minimum, I'd keep the bookmarks there as a backup. Opera 20 still needs a bookmark manager that provides for export of bookmarks, and better for import. As it is, all you can easily import (out of the browser's menu) (More Tools/Bookmark Importer) is the Opera 12 bookmarks. Otherwise it's a bit more complicated. Of course, you may want to keep using both browsers, till you're fully comfortable with making Opera 20 your home. I understand how with all of your bookmarks you do have a challenge. -
mythra last edited by
Hi everyone,
First of all I apologize for my English.
I was reading some posts and threads, particularly relating to bookmarks. Personally I could understand the choice of developers to delete the typical bookmarks in favor of speed dial (if it's seen as a new version/view of them), but in this case there MUST BE a tool to import and manage the old bookmarks in newer version of Opera.
However, I think that the bookmarks are just one of more and more problems in these latest versions: obviously I'm not referring to the problems of navigation in itself, but in the last 10 (and more) years I've chose Opera for its excellent U.I. and the ability to customize maybe everything, two things that I missed in the latest versions!!
Over the years I have never been disappointed by the new versions, especially from the point of view of the new features: speed dial and tab-grouping (and many other features) have become indispensable in my daily use both at work and at home, but I think that from version 20 there was a big step back.
I do not know if this forum is read by developers or by the management, but I hope that in the next versions, Opera return to be Opera and not a bad copy of Chrome or Firefox
bye
-
lem729 last edited by
If you chose Opera for the last ten years, then you can easily import your bookmarks into Opera 20. I believe do believe though tha Opera should make a high priority helping people in other browsers move bookmarks to Opera. While you can get people to jump through a few hoops to get them there, that hasn't adequately been done.
You chose Opera because of it's ability to customize everything, but that model HAS FUNDAMENTALLY changed. The new Opera model is to have a bare bones, fast attractive browser, and customizations will have to come through extensions in the Opera and/or Chrome stores now or in the future as new extensions are developed. And look, there are people very happy with this and people who aren't. I prefer to not have all of the customization features in the browser, because I don't need to do most of that customization, and what I want to do, I can do via extension. Why should the basic interface of Opera be loaded with features (that slow it down, make it unwieldly) for most people who don't need or want it?
If you want something special, and get an extension, you are not putting it on my system, only in yours. This is the model that Firefox and Chrome adopted, and which the vast preponderance of the public wants. They don't want to be stuck with all of your feature-heavy needs in their browser. Look, I think Opera Presto was a wonderful product, but it was becoming dated, some websites no longer worked in it, and it was a bit slow. Opera is a business, and a free product. They are looking for the market. I love the new Speed Dial, and find the browsing in it and in Opera fast and enjoyable. I like the new Stash and Discover features. And you can do tons of bookmarking, even traditional bookmarking in Opera 20. As for Opera Presto, the horse has left the barn and there is no point putting huge energy into fighting a rear guard action to get Opera to put development energy into it. The future is with the model of a fast, basic attractive browser, customized through world of extensions. if you want more features and more customization, put energy into getting developers to build extensions in the Opera and Chrome stores to accomplish that.
-
A Former User last edited by
So there IS a problem with the desktop version of Opera and its pretty clear that they most of their energy is invested elsewhere.
As reported during the financial presentation, fewer people are leaving the new Opera after trying it, and users are more active than they were with Opera 12 and below. With this kind of growth, the desktop version will continue to contribute significantly to Opera's revenue..
The entire ethos of Opera until recent times was to innovate NEW features which no-one had thought of before, and thus differentiate themselves from the competition.
You seem to be saying that Opera should innovate rather than reimplement old features that weren't very widely used in the first place. That seems to contradict the comments of those who want a focus on bringing back old features..
@xenmaster
Oh, great, this forum doesn't even work well with the New Opera :p.
My whitelines are not preserved, and I cannot edit my post.
It seems to work the same in Opera as in other browsers. They handle whitespace the same, and you can edit in all browsers. -
deld1ablo last edited by
wfhellersaid, on April 29
I have about 2600 bookmarks [give or take a hundred] in 17 directories in Opera12 - that is converted to speeddial that takes longer to load than Opera20 itself. That is why I want de normal bookmarks back.So they did not bother to test the new speed dial for performance? Thats really nice to know. And sad.
I assume the idea you want to do is basically Speed dial -> bookmark folder -> bookmarks, and then vaguely remember url or keyboards to go to the bookmarks when typing on the address bar? Thats quite reasonable.
-
prometheus-za last edited by
@jrista (if he or she is still here)
As a long time Opera user, since version 8 or so, I too feel the pain of Opera's reinvention, despite my still using it on both my work and home machines as my primary browser. HOWEVER, your approach to the problem, the sturm and drang and "OMG YOU SUCKK!!!!", is only going to antagonise people and presumably lead to a ban.Your choice is simple. Live with the situation, and work WITH Opera to help bring missed features back. Or move on and spare the rest of us your rudeness. Best of luck with what you decide.
Well granttlc, that is precisely what most of us have been trying to do. The problem is that most of our requests have fallen on deaf ears and the developers have even stated that Opera functionality up to v.12 will not return. What's antagonising us is a few trolls trying to make us out as a handful of people just whining for the sake of it. The fact is that our sentiment is that of the majority of long time Opera users. We are complaining because quite frankly someone has to. Opera is going down the drain. I'll repost what I posted in the other thread
Opera has been seeing a decline since v.10 when major changes were made to the UI. There was actually uptake with the addition of extensions. Opera 15 beta was released May 2013. Take a look at Opera desktop's decline since then. The increase in uptake in recent years has been the result of Opera Mini making the situation even bleaker for Opera desktop. But what's even more telling is that there's roughly a 50/50 split between v.12 and v.15+.
We are not complaining just for the sake of it, but because we are long time Opera users that loved it for what it was. It's our criticisms over the years that made it the great browser it was. If we didn't care we would simply move on but still nobody has a right to call us a bunch of whiners. -
-
Deleted User last edited by
I see the fanboys want to solve everything with extensions. Extensions can be nice if they're written and maintained by Opera. Relying on extensions written and maintained by Random Joe is so stupid, I don't even know where to begin.
Seriously, what's wrong with you people?
-
lem729 last edited by
Well, I do like the new Opera, much more than the old one, which suffered feature-glut to the nth degree. Having a major increase in speed, being able to get to more sites (that the old Opera was incompatible with), a "class of the world" speed dial (that makes me smile when I look at it as a home page), a huge increase in available extensions (three cheers for that) and much much more. So anyone who isn't sure, don't hesitate, but jump right in and get wet. The new browser is a lot of fun, and improving with each update. Now gog, you want Opera to write and maintain the extensions. Can't be done. It's not practical. It's not real. Trust in the marketplace. Lately, I've been writing developers whose extensions I use, or might consider using, explaining a feature or features I think might help. I've also been asking some Chrome developers to port their extensions to the Opera store. Everyone interested in the new Opera could some of that and it would help. The last thing we need is a browser with tons of exotica-features that the vast majority of people don't give a hang about. So why should Opera spend time and money programming for a tiny number of of power users on a browser they essentially give away for free ? Your wish (if it's for Opera to re-program in Opera Blink what was in Opera Presto) is essentially the bankruptcy of Opera. That's how much sense it makes. Now you say, gog, you don't know where to begin, which leaves me agog. The only place to begin is with acceptance of change. Stop trying to hold onto the past. It's gone, finis, history! Time to move on!
