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From Opera 12 to 20...a giant leap back for mankind

  • Indeed... an excellent set of observations. Thanks for bringing reason to this discussion, blackbird.

  • This is sad.

    I've been a huge fan of Opera since 2.x or 3.x or so. (I first used it so I could test compatibility of browsers visiting a website I created back when Netscape 2.0 was brand new)

    But last night's Windows XP updates seem to have killed the Opera 12.16 I was running. It repeatedly launched directly into "no longer responding" mode.

    So I uninstalled and installed the latest from the Opera website. Ver 20.x

    I worked with it for an hour, but with the dawning realization that it has been dumbed down to something I can't even relate to. No more "tweakability", 3/4 of the customizing/settings options are simply gone. Name it... all the reasons I used Opera are just absent. No more integrated email client.... no more... well ... looking around... what is left of Opera here? I reinstalled 12.16 but even a clean install is dead... it won't launch.

    So I'm back on Opera 20 and the standalone email client and feeling like I've been abandoned. Opera had it SO right for so many years, now this new interface feels disgusting and tacky and unmanageable, like I've accidentally opened IE or some other pariah browser.

    So sad.

    Disillusioned in Canada

  • You see, Blackbird, how your message goes right over the heads of the cry babies? They simply refuse to accept reality. (sigh)

  • The "reality" of this situation is that the user interface/functionality that for many years created a huge fan-base for this product has been pretty much devastated in the new version. All flaming/name-calling belligerence aside, this new product will not retain its oldest and most loyal fans if too many of the reasons for staying with them are missing.

    "Cry baby"? Flame on. I never cared about useless content like that. If no one comments about the negative aspects of change, then the impression may remain that it is all good, and everyone will be surprised by an unexplained exodus.

    (sigh)

  • Windows XP is going to be abandoned by Microsoft in April, leaving all XP users with the option to upgrade or face a gradual decline of usability on their out-of-date Operating System. It was released in October 2001, so we have had our money's worth.

    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/en-gb/xp/default.aspx?WT.mc_id=Consumer_View+Website_Mar+2014_None_XPEoS_SEM&WT.srch=1

    I already updated to Windows 7, seeing that it was inevitable.

    Thank you again to Blackbird for bringing some sanity to these forums, but his wisdom will be wasted on many. It is much easier to say, β€œStop whining, it's not going to change,” and leave the cry-babies to deal with it.

  • They simply refuse to accept reality.

    As I've indicated before, I completely agree with you and blackbird71 about the "reality", but I believe that your conclusion is flawed, for two reasons. One, many of the posters whom you're referring to do not accept that you and others who explain this "reality" actually know more about it than they do. For people who know certain things about the world of business and have been around the block a few times, the version of "reality" described by you and blackbird71 seems, if not absolutely incontrovertible, very compelling. But not everyone posting here has those qualifications, and for many if not all of those people, it's not a question of "accepting reality"; rather, it's a question of not having the knowledge and experience to recognize a compelling explanation when they see one. Two, people are driven primarily by emotion and only secondarily by fact/reason, and one of the main reasons people come here is simply to have whatever satisfaction can be gained by expressing their dissatisfaction on an Internet forum. To say that these posters are not "accepting reality" misses the point: they're disappointed,frustrated, and annoyed β€” a reaction that Opera ASA has brought upon themselves by the way they've chosen to handle both the rollout of Opera Blink and the increasingly unhelpful forum experience β€” and they want to express that, regardless of whether it actually has any effect on the development path of the Opera Blink browser. That is a "reality" that you have not apparently yet accepted.

  • You see, Blackbird, how your message goes right over the heads of the cry babies? They simply refuse to accept reality. (sigh)

    Since the reality--which is that Opera is basically dead--is quite bitter, it is pretty much expectable that some folks still refuse to accept it. And it's not much to blame or judge for if you ask me.

  • They simply refuse to accept reality.

    As I've indicated before, I completely agree with you and blackbird71 about the "reality", but I believe that your conclusion is flawed, for two reasons. One, many of the posters whom you're referring to do not accept that you and others who explain this "reality" actually know more about it than they do. ... Two, people are driven primarily by emotion and only secondarily by fact/reason, and one of the main reasons people come here is simply to have whatever satisfaction can be gained by expressing their dissatisfaction on an Internet forum. ...

    Your observations have much validity. But why I sometimes try patiently, and at such length in posts of this kind, is for the very reason of explaining the "why" of things, so that others might better understand "reality". If nobody explains it occasionally, how are they to learn? At least this way, they will have had the facts and explanations laid before them. Whether they then get their "emotions" under control and accept the current reality (unpleasant though it might be) is up to them, of course. But not accepting and dealing constructively with reality is a sure path to discontent and unhappiness.

    As I've posted before, I'm not happy with certain aspects of the Blink Opera releases to date, though I know others who are. But I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt to the developers and to Opera, in terms of waiting to see what features and configurability improvements ultimately emerge. I've used Opera for many years, at little or no cost to me... Opera's Presto browsers were often superb - though not always, and not without some real turmoil along the way. Given all that, I feel I owe Opera some patience to see where they eventually take their Blink implementation. Perhaps they'll finally "get there" for what I personally need in a browser; perhaps not. But life will still go on. If the browser doesn't evolve in "my" direction, there are always other browsers.

  • You see, Blackbird, how your message goes right over the heads of the cry babies? They simply refuse to accept reality. (sigh)

    What I see is someone who incessantly cries about people they label cry babies.

    Blackbirds post seems to have gone over your head as well because I (once again) fail to see how your rhetoric assists someone who is having difficulty upgrading now that their xp install is giving them problems.

    (sigh)

  • For what it's worth, Opera 12.16 is still working fine here on Windows XP with all the latest updates, and long may Opera 12.16 (and Windows XP) both continue to do so!
    πŸ™‚

  • I cant speak for others but for me I took the time to post my questions and concerns to show my support and appreciation for what opera was and what I hope the new version may become I fail to see why people are interpreted as cry babies or failing to control their emotions for pointing out the facts as they see them facts are facts not emotions. Furthermore the idea behind opera (to me) was transparency that is it was designed to be fast and simple as well as customizable rather than media rich and controlling like other modern software that uses the model of deciding what is best for endusers by giving them little choice.It seems that that many corporations rarely pursue this concept of being open and direct while some prosper of the fact that people want to support their integrity. If one were to make an observation about blackbirds post he mite view it as rather emotional and controversial (no offence blackbird) though I am not offended by it.I currently use opera 20 in hopes it will turn out to be a good and I would like to support its development and this includes being able to advise friends and others that opera is a good reliable browser to use.

  • explaining the "why" of things, so that others might better understand "reality". If nobody explains it occasionally, how are they to learn?

    Agreed. And you've done that well, which I'm sure has benefitted not only many who've posted here (and on the previous forum) but many who've only viewed, as well.

  • How to make a great browser turn into a pile of crap for a few users.

    I want a complese menu of settings, i cant log into gmail or google anymore
    i want the menu bar back, i dont like short cut , im not a technician im a user who like menus

    great job sabotaging opera browser....

    well. never before firefox looked soo good.

  • I have no problem logging into gmail or into Google. Not sure what your problem is but it isn't Opera 20. I guess if you must have a menu and you must have it now, then Firefox is a good alternative. Bye.

  • Seems like they are listening to their customer as much as Steam/EA/Codemasters. This is shite. More of my rantings can be read here https://forums.opera.com/discussion/1831985/yes-once-again#Item_4

    Total waste of time talking now to the devs, we are stuck with this shite. Looks like the money will be rolling in from now on for the Opera team. LOL.

  • Used Opera since the shareware days. The new Opera is a disgrace, all members who made the decision to go down that path should be sacked. Then return development of old Opera.

  • I have no problem logging into gmail or into Google. Not sure what your problem is but it isn't Opera 20. I guess if you must have a menu and you must have it now, then Firefox is a good alternative. Bye.

    Your business acumen is on display again I see

  • mantrhax wrote:
    <great job sabotaging opera browser....
    well. never before firefox looked soo good.>

    You are soooo right!

    Yesterday I installed the latest Firefox-version and had been totally delighted:
    looking brillant, colourful and nice - just fun.

    But: startup-time 16 seconds, though I have only a handful add-ons installed. No way to get this better.

    In oposite: Opera start-time 5 seconds and fast.

    What shall I do with a browser, when I have to wait a long time for coming up, though looking soo good and pretty?

    People complaining here should think before they take time to write anything.

  • I started using Opera some 10 years ago mostly so the browser I used for private browsing in work was different from the one one used for work. I got to like especially, at that time, the speed - important when you had a 256k connection.

    Naughty, I know, but I liked the Crtl+H feature that hides the browser to the notification area. That went and was replaced by Crtl+shift+H (Ctrl + H brought up the history instead) but you had the option to change it back - I'm using 12 here and can still do it.

    I had to restore my computer at home and that now has version 20 - it looks to be faster - but I miss that feature.

    Speed dial is probably the feature that kept me using the browser even when its compatibility with some websites was iffy.

    I'm not going to go back at home but will keep 12 for the foreseeable future at work.

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