Big problem with this forum. Some contributors.
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cogitosum last edited by
I've read many of the topics here and have contributed on a couple of occasions but...
After that all I see is condescending and argumentative posts from Pesala, scratchspace and leushino. Mostly telling us users that we don't understand the new Opera.
There are many, many posts concerning the lack of a bookmark toolbar - the only reply seems to be "use the QAB. That's not what we simple users want.
I commented that the ability to right-click an image and then be able to view the Exif data had disappeared. Totally ignored since Pesala, scratchspace and leushino were arguing amongst themselves.Many other posters after an answer have commented "what an unpleasant forum - no help at all". I agree.
We're not after solutions - as far as bookmarks are concerned, there isn't one. Just maybe an acknowledgement of what we miss and a statement as to whether the concern will be addressed in the (near) future - if at all.
Please, please Pesala, scratchspace and leushino stop arguing and just acknowledge the OPs
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by CogitoSum:
There are many, many posts concerning the lack of a bookmark toolbar - the only reply seems to be "use the QAB. That's not what we simple users want.
I don't get it! The Quick Access Bar *is* the bookmark toolbar, it has a different name but includes the same basic functionality.
Originally posted by CogitoSum:
I commented that the ability to right-click an image and then be able to view the Exif data had disappeared. Totally ignored since Pesala, scratchspace and leushino were arguing amongst themselves.
But what did you want to hear? The functionality is not there anymore, not even a simple image proprieties, this function is hardly used by anyone let alone accessing the EXIF data. No other browser that I know of will give you an EXIF viewer out-of-the-box, that's where extensions come in.
When there isn't one in the Opera catalog because the extension developer didn't care to publish it, there are ways to install Chrome extension in Opera.
A quick web search lead me to this Chrome extension, it can display EXIF data:
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/image-properties-context/khagclindddokccfbmfmckaflngbmponPerhaps they thought the knowledge about these solutions was a given...
Now, if they were arguing with each other I think there must have been a reason for that. I checked the topic you're referring to and it's pretty lengthy and a small detail like the one you added to the topic can go unnoticed (specially because you don't phrase it like asking for an answer). -
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frenzie last edited by
Originally posted by rafaelluik:
I don't get it! The Quick Access Bar *is* the bookmark toolbar, it has a different name but includes the same basic functionality.
The bookmarks bar contains a selection of bookmarks for quick access. A speed dial that's always there, if you will. Shoving all bookmarks on it is inefficient, your own disregard for your older, "useless" bookmarks notwithstanding. There isn't even an option to display them all as icons/images only. We've thus established it's not very good as a bookmarks bar and does not contain the same basic functionality, while we haven't even touched on standard bookmark features like keywords/nicknames and description.
Originally posted by rafaelluik:
But what did you want to hear? The functionality is not there anymore, not even a simple image proprieties, this function is hardly used by anyone let alone accessing the EXIF data. No other browser that I know of will give you an EXIF viewer out-of-the-box, that's where extensions come in.
I use it.
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j7nj7n last edited by
The Exif viewer was very basic. And while it wasn't vital for web browsing, the size reading and full copyable address were, in order to recognize, for example, when and if an image had been updated on a remote server. Wikipedia also parses and shows us some Exif fields, regarding them as important enough. With this change, we are relying on web sites to implement (slow!) functionality that was available for each and every web site before.
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by Frenzie:
Originally posted by rafaelluik:
I don't get it! The Quick Access Bar *is* the bookmark toolbar, it has a different name but includes the same basic functionality.
The bookmarks bar contains a selection of bookmarks for quick access. A speed dial that's always there, if you will. Shoving all bookmarks on it is inefficient, your own disregard for your older, "useless" bookmarks notwithstanding. There isn't even an option to display them all as icons/images only. We've thus established it's not very good as a bookmarks bar and does not contain the same basic functionality, while we haven't even touched on standard bookmark features like keywords/nicknames and description.
Well that was not defined by the OP.
Originally posted by Frenzie:
Originally posted by rafaelluik:
But what did you want to hear? The functionality is not there anymore, not even a simple image proprieties, this function is hardly used by anyone let alone accessing the EXIF data. No other browser that I know of will give you an EXIF viewer out-of-the-box, that's where extensions come in.
I use it.
Then the solution is to use an extension, as I said no other browser will give you EXIF without an extension.
Originally posted by scratchspace:
Presto>Blink transition FAQ
I think this help page is the closest we have to a FAQ:
http://help.opera.com/opera/Windows/1241/en/migration.htmlI agree it's not complete, imagine listing every Opera-Presto function, and the bookmarks bar will be added to it only after it is released with the opera:flags item enabled by default for example... But that's the "vanilla" Opera they planned to deliver most of its users from the beginning.
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by Frenzie:
There isn't even an option to display them all as icons/images only.
Edit the bookmark and remove the name.
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frenzie last edited by
Originally posted by rafaelluik:
Well that was not defined by the OP.
ersi already pointed out the purpose of the bookmarks bar to you last week.
Originally posted by Opera 12.16 Help:
Put your favorite bookmarks/bookmarklets, bookmark folders, and web searches on the bookmarks bar so you can use them quickly and at any time (emphasis mine).
This is how I've always seen the bookmarks/favorite bar used, even though I doubt any of its users ever read the manual.
Originally posted by rafaelluik:
Then the solution is to use an extension, as I said no other browser will give you EXIF without an extension.
What unique features of Opera did you use, by the way?
Originally posted by Pesala:
Edit the bookmark and remove the name.
I actually hadn't thought of that, but I doubt those who actually use this functionality care much. (I use nicknames.) They're not going to edit 30-50 bookmarks to get them to display properly when they can just use Firefox or Internet Explorer instead.
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by Frenzie:
ersi already pointed out the purpose of the bookmarks bar to you last week.
I came to this topic to answer CogitoSum, not ersi.
Originally posted by Frenzie:
What unique features of Opera did you use, by the way?
User-defined Speed Dial items and Ctrl+# for SDs, Turbo/Off-road occasionally, access to the full list of closed tabs/windows in a session, sync, Notes, full text history search, non-modal dialog boxes, open new windows as tabs (that created problems though because pages that didn't fit in a tab area would create scrollbars), sessions (realized I never really needed it as a temporary bookmarks or Speed Dial folder will do the job) - Continue from last time is worth using though -, the convenience of Ctrl and Shift modifier keys in menus (missing but in the address field it's Alt+Enter now), mouse gestures, non-scrollable tab bar, tab thumbnails "tooltips", when closing a tab activate the last active, close tabs to the right, reload an individual image when it fails to load (although "Open image in a new tab" will also allow me to access it), TAB focusing only form elements, easy hyperlinked text selection, prioritization of the loading of text over images, I used to download videos from any page via opera:cache now I use the Inspector to get the link. And finally, the absence of non-standardized/proprietary technologies in the browser (NaCl, H.264).
Some of that things are available on other browsers but debuted in Opera years earlier...
Some of that is missing or require a change of habit (for now I replaced Opera Notes with Google Keep, etc) but some isn't available in any other browser out of the box either (Sped Dial, Ctrl and Shift modifier keys, etc) still so I choose Opera 17. -
frenzie last edited by
Originally posted by rafaelluik:
I came to this topic to answer CogitoSum, not ersi.
Fair enough. CogitoSum wasn't looking for answers and was just whining, to put it in leushino's words. But I still think it's important to point out that for now the only bookmarks bar the QAB is equal to is the least functional specimen in Chromium. haavard has assured us it will get better, but unfortunately with Chromium as a baseline that doesn't necessarily mean much. Still, up to IE's level would be better than nothing.
Originally posted by rafaelluik:
User-defined Speed Dial items and Ctrl+# for SDs, Turbo/Off-road occasionally, [snip] And finally, the absence of non-standardized/proprietary technologies in the browser (NaCl, H.264).
We have some overlap after all!
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by CogitoSum:
Big problem with this forum. Some contributors.
The biggest problem is with some users whining about features missing from Opera 17, without even attempting to understand the reasons behind the changes, and being argumentative when helpful answers are given.
You said that you miss the Bookmarks Bar, but perhaps what you really meant was the Bookmarks Menu, or the Bookmarks Panel, or the Bookmarks Manager? The answer to what you actually said has been given many times — the Quick Access Bar is the best replacement available. In fact, it is better than the Bookmarks Bar in some respects, in that it supports D&D.
As regards the comment “a statement as to whether the concern will be addressed in the (near) future - if at all,” it has been said many times, “more features will return later.” If you want a comment specifically about the image properties dialogue, IMO it won't return. It is something an extension could do.
Originally posted by CogitoSum:
Many other posters after an answer have commented "what an unpleasant forum - no help at all". I agree.
What makes it an unpleasant forum is whiners violating the Rules of Conduct by starting threads to attack other forum members.
#2 Never post negative forum threads about other forum members.
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cogitosum last edited by
Originally posted by Pesala:
Originally posted by CogitoSum:
Big problem with this forum. Some contributors.
The biggest problem is with some users whining about features missing from Opera 17, without even attempting to understand the reasons behind the changes, and being argumentative when helpful answers are given.
I've read all the responses here with interest. This is my first response so please where I am argumentative. Stating my regret that some (two) functions have disappeared is not whining - it's a statement of regret. Any reasons behind the changes are immaterial. The bookmark bar has gone as has the ability to display Exif data.
Originally posted by Pesala:
You said that you miss the Bookmarks Bar, but perhaps what you really meant was the Bookmarks Menu, or the Bookmarks Panel, or the Bookmarks Manager? The answer to what you actually said has been given many times — the Quick Access Bar is the best replacement available. In fact, it is better than the Bookmarks Bar in some respects, in that it supports D&D.
The QAB is a decent alternative but there's a problem. The QAB entry for my bookmarks shows my imported bookmarks. The bookmark importer (from the top left) doesn't show all the folders so I can't split my bookmarks up into individual QAB entries. If you could explain how to overcome this?
Originally posted by Pesala:
As regards the comment “a statement as to whether the concern will be addressed in the (near) future - if at all,” it has been said many times, “more features will return later.” If you want a comment specifically about the image properties dialogue, IMO it won't return. It is something an extension could do.
Indeed extensions could do. But then again why should I import an extension to allow me to import a Chrome extension when I can far more easily use Chrome?
Originally posted by Pesala:
[What makes it an unpleasant forum is whiners violating the Rules of Conduct by starting threads to attack other forum members.
I really am sorry that my request that you stop arguing is treated as an attack.
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by CogitoSum:
This is my first response so please where I am argumentative.
I wasn't talking about you, but about rs79 who posted the thread that you complained about by starting this one. The big problem is with users posting rant threads, without searching or asking for support first. Almost always, posting flame-bait will start a flame-war, while posting a polite comment or request for help will usually elicit helpful responses.
#4 Lengthy rants can be a pain to read, and so the chances of a useful reply are drastically reduced. Remember, your audience is comprised of other Opera users who help you in their own free time. Keep it brief, and focus on the actual topic.
Some users troll the forums with nothing better to do than argue with the ranters and flame-bait posters. I usually try to address their issues. The issues that rs79 was whining about were already addressed many times before.
The many one-time posters or new users fail to realise that some of us visit here almost every day, so we see things from a different perspective. It gets more than a bit tiresome responding to “Why did they remove the bookmarks?” especially when they have not been removed.
Originally posted by CogitoSum:
Indeed extensions could do. But then again why should I import an extension to allow me to import a Chrome extension when I can far more easily use Chrome?
Now that's what I call “being argumentative.”
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jito463 last edited by
Originally posted by Pesala:
the Quick Access Bar is the best replacement available. In fact, it is better than the Bookmarks Bar in some respects, in that it supports D&D.
I've seen you mention this before, Pesala, and I'm assuming by D&D you mean Drag and Drop? I don't get what you're implying, because 12.16 definitely supports this already, and I distinctly remember earlier versions, as well (though I can't recall specifically which). Thus making your statement moot.
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by Jito463:
I've seen you mention this before, Pesala, and I'm assuming by D&D you mean Drag and Drop? I don't get what you're implying, because 12.16 definitely supports this already, and I distinctly remember earlier versions, as well (though I can't recall specifically which).
They only support Drag and Drop of bookmarks and folders on the Bookmarks Bar, not D&D of bookmarks within folders, which is far more important for organising your bookmarks. You can use right-click cut/paste or open the Bookmarks Panel, and Organiser, and do it there, but the Bookmarks Bar (and menu) don't easily lend themselves to organising bookmarks.
The QAB also supports "Sort alphabetically," which avoids a lot of work too.
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A Former User last edited by
Originally posted by CogitoSum:
Indeed extensions could do. But then again why should I import an extension to allow me to import a Chrome extension when I can far more easily use Chrome?
If you like Opera's core features and values better following that simple extra step is worth it.
You don't actually need to install the extension but I think it's easier to point to it than to this.
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cogitosum last edited by
Originally posted by Pesala:
They only support Drag and Drop of bookmarks and folders on the Bookmarks Bar, not D&D of bookmarks within folders, which is far more important for organising your bookmarks. You can use right-click cut/paste or open the Bookmarks Panel, and Organiser, and do it there, but the Bookmarks Bar (and menu) don't easily lend themselves to organising bookmarks.
The QAB also supports "Sort alphabetically," which avoids a lot of work too.Originally posted by CogitoSum:
The QAB is a decent alternative but there's a problem. The QAB entry for my bookmarks shows my imported bookmarks. The bookmark importer (from the top left) doesn't show all the folders so I can't split my bookmarks up into individual QAB entries. If you could explain how to overcome this?
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