Bad scrolling

samstabauser

samstabauser @neetesha

Video is problematic because i dont have a camera that shot in 60 fps right now.
maybe i can do this if i got a camera.

So what did you confirm exactly 15 days ago?
and what did you change?

Cause i´m not a native english speaker how would you describe these different scrolling styles?
If you use kinetic scrolling, smooth scrolling is still there.

neetesha

neetesha

@samstabauser We had an issue about scrolling in past which we fixed in 48.2.2331.133274. and since then we do not experience any issue with scrolling.

samstabauser

samstabauser @neetesha

@neetesha

so i finally got a 720p60 Videocamera that captured this problem...

https://youtu.be/XGjarsHZvjc

Im not happy with youtube compression but you still can see kinetic scrolling is way smoother while finger scrolling is juddering.

Hope this helps.

samstabauser

samstabauser

so problem still exist.

This bad scrolling problem also exist on the Google Nexus successor Pixel2 XL.
https://productforums.google.com/forum/#!topic/chrome/Ev24GWfSEUE
He tried Opera browser v.49 on this Android 9 device that use a Qualcomm 835 highend SoC.

Thanks Andrey for your feedback.

From time to time i will report if this huge regression is solved or not.

Samsung updated it´s browser to Version 8.0.xxx and switched to chromium 63 engine.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sec.android.app.sbrowser.beta&hl=de

Still smooth finger scrolling behaviour.

starfruit135

starfruit135 @neetesha

@neetesha
The problem still exists in 49.2.2361.134358. I'm experiencing it on every web site. The kinetic acceleration(?) is too sensitive. If kinetic scrolling is like this, normal scrolling is much better.

samstabauser

samstabauser @starfruit135

@starfruit135
Thank you! Still the same here on my Samsung T580 tablet.

Would you please write which Android device you exactly use?
https://forums.opera.com/topic/26794/instructions-on-posting-about-problems-in-opera-for-android/2

samstabauser

samstabauser

@neetesha said in Bad scrolling:

@samstabauser We have checked the issue here and it is not reproducing locally. If possible could you please share a video to explain what exactly bothering you?

as it seems my video doesn´t realy help for easy understanding what i and 4 other opera fans are complaining here.

Here is a website that does show this stutter behaviour on moving text better. It is a techdemo website that REproduce complex problems in display technology faults.
https://www.testufo.com/framerates-text

btw scrolling user experience on current opera touch and opera mini versions right now offer are still fine but the GUI is not the same and not what i (we) need.

boti99

boti99

Still not good. I must use v47.3. In opera 47 is perfect and smooth. Please fix it.

boti99

boti99

The problem still exists.

ginger1984

ginger1984 @samstabauser

Galaxy S8 has it too. Both in Chrome and Opera. But not in a Webview based browser. I have an Exynos SOC and not a Quallacom unfortunately. Yes it's a Samsung thing. At XDA people noticed it too. Alone the Samsung browser working great is unfortunate.

At these devices Opera Mini does use Webview and yes Webview then it works very smooth.

At my Samsung Quallacom SOC Tablet it works fine, but not at Exynos SOC based phone or tablet.

Rumor has it people with Samsung Galaxy S10 with Exynos SOC have it too.

I prefer Opera, but on Exynos SOC of Samsung it's not Opera.

I am sorry. Since Opera and even Google cannot, without working together with Samsung about Exynos specific details on it, undo this.

If I buy another Samsung, I think I will select it not to have Samsung it's own SOC, the Exynos.

I don't believe Samsung doesn't know. But all Exynos users are probably affected.

Keywords: Samsung Galaxy Scrolling Stutter Chrome Opera

Note: This is not specific to all models, but only certain Samsung SOC, mainly Exynos.

I replied at your YouTube and I recognize it, since it is like as if Scrolling happening only at say 10 frames per second. I can really visually count the number of frames.

Kinetic Scrolling isn't really noticable though.

Sad story, ironically since Chrome has it too, and Chrome is also Webview in Android, questions are;

Why does an application not known as a browser but using just Chrome still works smooth?

Well, I would sit at the table with Samsung if I were Google. Since Google it's browser suffering too, only Samsung Browser or Opera Mini ( used Webview ) are working smooth.

And yes I factory reset, everything, it took months to understand.

It's Samsung doing something. At least at Exynos SOC. Not all Samsung devices have Exynos so Opera HQ team might find perfect smooth Scrolling at supposed same device, though it has same name it might have different SOC.

@samstabauser said in Bad scrolling:

@leocg

no difference between kinetic-scrolling and normal scrolling style? hardly to believe.

by the way

I use a Samsung Tab A 2016 tablet (T580) with current Android 8.1 but Andorid 7 was the same.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Samsung-Galaxy-Tab-A-10-1-2016-Tablet-Review.171710.0.html

Coud be possible that this bug only exist on certain android devices.
The stutter scrolling behaviour also exist on my Huawei honor 6x.
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Honor-6X-Smartphone-Review.207056.0.html
Thats why i still use older Opera for android apk´s on this device too.

Should really be investigate by software engineers.

one more thing 30 vs 60 fps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChsT-y7Yvkk

https://www.testufo.com/ (on of my fav tech sites)

samstabauser

samstabauser @ginger1984

@ginger1984

thank you for your reply. It´s so sad - they still just don´t fix that issue.

One think i have to add.
it is NOT only a Samsung Chrome opera problem in my opinion,
cause it also exist on my Huawei Honor 6x with Hi-Silicon Kirin 655 SoC

Good the XDA people also recognise this problem.

Just translate this webpage to your language...
https://www.androidpit.de/samsung-galaxy-smartphones-apple-iphone-nach-updates-langsamer-strafe

there are words for such behaviour - planned obsolescence

Fun fact - as you wrote Samsung highend smartphones S8 and S10 are also affected. So it´s not only a budget class problem.

Glad i/we have android apks to install an old version to fix this issue.

ginger1984

ginger1984 @samstabauser

@samstabauser Samsung paid a 5 million fine for artificial slowing down I read, oh man sad man, that did not solve the problem. I know installing a custom ROM disables the detection of browsers not allowed to run normally, but that voids KNOX and means no banking or Netflix. I try to explain in pseudo code what is happening.

#define CPU_SLOW 1
#define CPU_OVERCLOCKED 2
#define CPU_NORMAL 0

int FoolUserToBuyNewPhone(char * foregroundProcesName)
(
if( !strcmp(foregroundProcesName,"Antutu Benchmark") )
return CPU_OVERCLOCKED;

if( buildDate ≥ releaseDate + 1 year ) {
if {IsNotSamsungBrowser() && !IsWebView() )
return CPU_SLOW;
else
return CPU_NORMAL;

return CPU_NORMAL;
}

At XDA they noticed it very obviously, it's a tiny piece of code only that detects which kind of browser but let's WebView unaffected. This can be proven at my S8 since WebView is same as Chrome and Opera Mini, but Chrome which supplies the WebView to Samsung too is unaffected, but if it's called Chrome than it's very slow.

At XDA developers there are a few tech specialists and they too are a little upset and frustrated.

My solution is accepting Samsung browser, since it's not Opera or Google fault. Microsoft did this with Netscape and Firefox a long time ago.

In the example is also shown the detection of benchmark software. Which has been proven at Linux Techtips and XDA too.

Sad news, welcome to the Samsung club. Lineage OS ROM is now only solution, but you will loose banking and Netflix and Camera with exception of primitive basic Camera functions.

🥺

Time to go to XDA developers, maybe people,... ooh well

This is Samsung it's way to say it's time to buy a new Galaxy for 750 Euro.

I don't like it, how can I sell this phone without being dishonest? I use it for browsing and it wants Samsung browser unless I or the buyer learning to live with a stuttering experience.

boti99

boti99

Google's News app has this issue as well. This proves your theory so the Chrome browser engine causes the problem.

samstabauser

samstabauser @ginger1984

@ginger1984
pseudo code

if then else

or case ??

This is Samsung it's way to say it's time to buy a new Galaxy for 750 Euro.

I won´t do that

btw i installed the Samsung browser on my huawei Honor
THAT produce stuttering too, i can tell you. Someone on google playstore comment this too and Samsung reaction was.
Other device manufacturer doesn´t have that technology to deliver the Samsung experience. I can´t believe they really put such a reaction online.

But opera shouldn´t be like this cause it´s chinese too.
Hope firefox for android will get a better GUI + more fluid reaction behaviour . It´s just a mess on android.

ginger1984

ginger1984 @samstabauser

My Samsung Galaxy S3 from 2012 spare phone with Lineage OS Nougat works fluently in scrolling. Only because of its 700 megabyte memory I can open 3 websites only simultaneously. But hey it's faster than my 4000 Megabytes memory Samsung Galaxy S8.

I tried scrolling with Samsung Browser in pop-up over tiny window over Opera. In developer options of my phone I enabled GPU profiler, and Webview seems detached from directly getting touch screen input and works very well like Opera mini is smooth.

Samsung browser has a detached from touchscreen directly like GPU profile too.

Communicating touchscreen events directly to Opera or Chrome main thread that is also the viewport seems to be culprit here.

I suggest Opera developers to try a simple overlay window that passes touch events forward to the web viewport in NDK since directly communicating with NDK is problematic. Not only for Opera but for Yandex, Chrome, Brave browsers...

Opera could do this as Opera Dev version e.g.

I turned almost into Steve Jobs. Steve was known for forcing the development team to look for another better way.

ginger1984

ginger1984 @boti99

@boti99 Message pump overflow from touchscreen events. @miyukiwork maybe you can forward this to your team deciding what is important.

Stutter is observed in such a stable way, that it seems touch events overflow the message que. When this happens, touch events are dropped. Then browser viewport stops responding a short time, perhaps 100 millisecond. Then the touch events message que is ready to be filled with new touch events, and it happens again. As in native development kit Opera seems to not be able to filter out unimportant messages fed from the touch screen. Like it's not necessary to process for example duplicate touch events. This is not happening at all devices.

At least it's such a stable stuttering and so depending on touch events, ask your team for studying how many events a touchscreen can send in so little time. It's rather Opera now wants to process all events but that is unadvisable.

A millisecond pause for example in processing the message pump from touchscreen events can prevent this flood.

https://www.quora.com/Why-does-Android-scrolling-animation-stutter

samstabauser

samstabauser

@ginger
thank you for your support at this point.
I appreciate all your input in this issue.
Hope we really whip the Llama's A..
I still prefer the opera for android GUI.

P.S.:
My last iOS device was an iphone 4s with iOS 8 and 9.
What i really dislike is: Safari does not support kinetic scrolling. at least till iOS 9.3.5
Does anyone know if this issue is still in current iOS versions?

A Former User

yes same problem here. i already wrote an email to opera support, no response.

my Solution:
Uninstall Version 46 and newer (what you get right now from google playstore is v. 48.x) and go back to Version 45!
Where do you get official opera Final apks?
https://get.geo.opera.com/pub/opera/android/4500/

Than scrolling websites while your finger is on the screen is as -smooth- as only kinetic scrolling is right now in opera for android browsers...
... and like it is on the homescreen. 60 fps - i like

alternative try Samsung internet browser.

technical info:
i think its a problem that is called Enable resampling scroll events

Opera for android, google chrome and Samsung internet browser are using chromium as engine...

Hope they will fix this annoying bug and bring back project butter on our surf-tablets and smartphones.

ginger1984

ginger1984

My Samsung S5e tablet and Galaxy S8 both are unusable with Opera, Chrome, Edge, Yandex.

I am forced to use Samsung browser. When I got the 2019 Samsung S5e tablet everything worked great. However I am in vendor lock in to use Samsung browser now.

It's legal to force people to use Samsung browser since Samsung is not a monopoly.

Don't like it. Opera version you mentioned is the latest chromium based build that works smoothly.

Opera should open their eyes, Samsung is forcing to use Samsung browser.

It's not Opera it's the Samsung firmware. Opera has no chance against a bigger Samsung anyway.

Yes artificially slowed stuttering browsers unless it's Samsung browser at a Samsung device.

I think Opera does care but simply it's a matter of hear no monopoly, see no monopoly, ...

Here is a open letter at XDA developers about Samsung and monopoly at Samsung devices

https://forum.xda-developers.com/tab-s5e/help/stutter-lag-jitter-letter-to-samsung-t4021487

samstabauser

samstabauser

cant believe it - nearly 2 years later.

i installed opera beta for android Opera beta_60.0.2955.54227
on my Samsung t580 tablet
via play store

and no judder while finger scrolling anymore

Thanks a lot to the developter