Where are the bookmarks in Opera 18?

  • I am responsible for determining which Browser my Company should use and will only move away from our standard Internet Explorer (IE) browser if there is a better alternative. I was attracted by recent news that Opera had won an award for it's latest browser so I downloaded Opera 18 about an hour ago. It certainly runs faster than IE so I decide to give it a more thorough try. My first task was to load up our standard bookmarks html list so I went to the help section and typed in "Bookmarks" so that I could receive guidance on how to achieve my objective. All I got was a message informing me that "No results matches on search "bookmarks". Please try refining your keywords. Did you mean: bookmarks". Since I did indeed mean "bookmarks", then I clicked on the suggestion and ......I got the same message. There is clearly something wrong here when a common requirement for "bookmarks" brings up nothing. I did more searching via IE and discovered that in Opera "bookmarks" are actually called "Speed Dial". It seems a little odd not to use a term that everyone understands but, so what, I will try out "Speed Dial". I then went to the import process and pointed "Speed Dial" to my Companies "bookmarks.html" list and pressed go. Off it went and quickly presented me with a recognisable list of bookmarks. I expected to be asked to accept the list but....no! I am now required to go every single item and accept/reject it. Since the company has some 4,000 bookmarks in a nested list then this process is complete pain!!!!! I decided to select a few items just to test the import process and then I waited for for the results....and I waited.....and I waited etc, etc. I was staggered to find that Opera doesn't adopt the standard and efficient process of creating a bookmarks list....Oh, no. Instead, it created a large icon with picture of ever single bookmark. Needless to say this takes forever!!! Frankly I gave up after an hour because my import list id only a fraction of the total. The Company staff would kill me if I presented them with this monstrosity as an alternative to IE. HOW ON EARTH DID THIS RUBBISH WIN AN AWARD?

    I think you will have gathered that Opera is no longer on my wish list and I struggle to comprehend why anyone would create a browser on this basis unless they have a death wish. There is one good thing that came from this experiment. I now have endless fun explaining all of this to everyone I meet and we all have a good laugh at Opera's expense. Keep up the good work of embarrassing yourself - we all love the light relief you are so generously and selflessly creating. Unfortunately, you will go bust shortly and this "fun time" will be short lived.

  • Your frustration is shared by many long term users of Opera like me. I have over 3,000 bookmarks and the new system drives me to distraction and unless Opera improves the "bookmarks" issue it will loose long term users like me and also, like you, drive away new potential new customers too. It is clear that Opera feels that it should concentrate on users who need no more that a couple of pages worth of Speed Dial entries - i.e. about 24 icons. Any more than that becomes a pain to handle. I wonder how large a market share that number represents?

  • Originally posted by yakyelnats:

    Your frustration is shared by many long term users of Opera like me. I have over 3,000 bookmarks and the new system drives me to distraction and unless Opera improves the "bookmarks" issue it will loose long term users like me and also, like you, drive away new potential new customers too. It is clear that Opera feels that it should concentrate on users who need no more that a couple of pages worth of Speed Dial entries - i.e. about 24 icons. Any more than that becomes a pain to handle. I wonder how large a market share that number represents?

    I can see that I have raised a touchy subject. However, I have no interest in continuing this debate because I have already rejected Opera and am now testing out Google Chrome. It seems to be a much better proposition because it:-

    1. too is fast enough for my Company needs.
    2. has a proper "bookmarks" system.
    3. also offers to manage "sessions" where a list of frequently used web sites can be easily loaded as and when needed. Opera does not offer that basic need either!

    I have now said my piece and so this is my last posting on this Forum because clearly Opera is a lost cause.

    Many thanks for your response.

  • Originally posted by alderdale:

    Keep up the good work of embarrassing yourself

    :lol: How did you get a job in IT?

    You should have searched the forum or asked first before embarrassing yourself.

    Instead of importing 4,000 bookmarks to Speed Dial, import them to the Quick Access Bar (aka Bookmarks Bar). That's still rather a lot of bookmarks for the QAB to handle, but as long as they are well organised into folders and subfolders it should work well enough. I have about 1,200 bookmarks in 86 folders/subfolders.

    For "Sessions" the Speed Dial is fine. Stack a number of speed dials on top of each other to create a Speed Dial folder. Right-click on the folder to open them all at once.

    It's not as powerful as sessions were in earlier versions of Opera, but it is a viable solution to open a number of bookmarks at once. Right-click on a folder to open all bookmarks in a folder is another method.

    A Bookmarks Organiser or import/export to other programs is not implemented yet, but D&D on the Quick Access Bar is OK for organising the odd few bookmarks. Right-click and sort alphabetically also helps a lot.

  • Just tried Opera and was frustrated by the lack of a familiar Bookmarks system as well. Among other things, I searched in the Help section and "Bookmark" wasn't found, although it did ask me if I meant "Bookmark" (yes, just as I had searched) which was a dead link. Eventually I gave up and uninstalled. I did see that Stash was being promoted (which didn't look like an appealing or true Bookmark system) and that QAB may've been an answer, but I didn't see a quick way to understand and use it.

    If there are any essential features to a browser a simple and user friendly Bookmarks system would certainly seem to be one. That on first inspection Opera doesn't have that is a problem and strikes me as a major marketing debacle.

    Thanks.

  • After disastrous v15 update (which resulted in me migrating to comodo dragon), I decided to give it a go once more. Thinking logically from v15 to v18 the new engine should be pretty much polished already and planned features added (after releasing v15, there were some rumours that some features will be ported from v12 in upcoming versions). The first thing I obviously noticed was the still massive lack of features compared to Opera v12. It also lost that silky smooth scrolling, which previously made browsing experience much more pleasant. But heck... It's still Opera, right? So it deserves a second chance.. I was trying to use it, I mean really trying.. But after some 20mins I gave up searching for that unheard feature called 'bookmarks' :D and how to import them from html... It's gone. That's it, that's too much, I'am speechless, that's RIDICULOUS. Everything which in the past made the Opera browser great and desirable is now gone, and the removal of bookmarks put the last nail on it's grave. :rip:

  • Originally posted by SmOgER:

    But after some 20mins I gave up searching for that unheard feature called 'bookmarks' :D and how to import them from html... It's gone. That's it, that's too much, I'am speechless, that's RIDICULOUS. Everything which in the past made the Opera browser great and desirable is now gone, and the removal of bookmarks put the last nail on it's grave. :rip:

    What is ridiculous is the lack of reading comprehension demonstrated by so many one-time posters. If you had read Pesala's post above, you would have realized that hundreds (no... thousands) of bookmarks can be made to reside on the QAB if you would simply follow directions. But I believe you don't want to follow directions but simply registered to whine and then vanished. :bye: :bye:

  • There is a certain look and feel to windows products that people expect to see and can be changed only at great peril. Microsoft learned this when they dumped the usual desktop in Windows 8, hence 8.1. I am not widely experienced with other than the most popular browsers; but are there many other browsers which do not implement bookmarks the usual way? Most call them bookmarks and IE calls them favorites but they are identical in operation. This is one of the fundamental features of browsers that people expect to have available. I think Opera is banging its head against a wall on this one. They must have had a reason for not implementing bookmarks, maybe planning to deliver ads on Speed Dial. Funneling everyone through speed dial would be a great way to deliver ads.

  • The OP was clearly frustrated but that is no excuse for his dismissive attitude. I also find it rather remarkable than an individual responsible for a company's browser isn't already familiar and experienced with the major alternatives to IE.

    That aside, I just wanted to say I came here because, like others apparently, I was surprised and disappointed that Opera is handling an essential feature the way it is and thought consumer feedback would be constructive.

    Thanks again. :)

  • Originally posted by leushino:

    Originally posted by SmOgER:

    But after some 20mins I gave up searching for that unheard feature called 'bookmarks' :D and how to import them from html... It's gone. That's it, that's too much, I'am speechless, that's RIDICULOUS. Everything which in the past made the Opera browser great and desirable is now gone, and the removal of bookmarks put the last nail on it's grave. :rip:

    What is ridiculous is the lack of reading comprehension demonstrated by so many one-time posters. If you had read Pesala's post above, you would have realized that hundreds (no... thousands) of bookmarks can be made to reside on the QAB if you would simply follow directions. But I believe you don't want to follow directions but simply registered to whine and then vanished. :bye: :bye:

    I don't need QAB nor any "smart bookmarks" or speed dials, all I want is a fricking bookmarks bar below address bar so I could open the page I want with the SINGLE mouse click (it's a PC after all and not some 7" tablet) and be able to import html, like in any other browser but Opera. Cheers, I love you too. ;)

    If not the rendering issues and discontinued support for fixing them, I'am sure I would be writing this now from Opera 12.16. Besides small bugs to be fixed, IMO it was a perfect browser really, especially when you compare it to something like this.. a window with address bar.

  • I've observed that one of the common elements of quite a number of negative initial postings about Opera's bookmarks situation is that users who first fire up the new Opera are unable to locate or figure out its 'bookmarking' functionality. All the past "expert" instructional postings in this forum are of no value right at that point of usage, for a new Opera user who's unable to figure out within the browser what he must now do to import, save, or display what most of the browsing universe term "bookmarks" or "favorites". Nothing native to the browser provides guidance on the limits or tradeoffs of the alternatives Opera does provide under whatever other name. The browser itself simply doesn't inform him in terms he can understand or identify with. Is it any surprise many frustrated users come here and complain?

    On the one hand, Opera wants to attract non-technical users new to the Opera experience. On the other hand, Opera seems to presuppose those users to already be conversant with the tech details of what it takes to truly run Opera, along with the limitations and sometimes-arcane settings paths that must be used to accomplish some of its functionality - "arcane", because these are hardly intuitive in comparison with that browser universe with which such non-technical users are likely to already have experience. Moreover, this extends beyond the realm of bookmarks into other features/functionality as well.

    The newer versions are slowly beginning to evolve toward some recognizable similarities in terminology and procedures with other browsers, but unfortunately that same progression is causing its own kind of confusion as functionality existing but hidden in one release suddenly appears fully present in the next one.

    Suggestion: Opera seriously needs to get a team working ASAP on a coherent, instantly-accessible instruction/helps/how-to database for new users, broken out by version number, else it risks alienating the very group it seeks to attract. Just sayin'...

  • Originally posted by SmOgER:

    I don't need QAB nor any "smart bookmarks" or speed dials, all I want is a fricking bookmarks bar below address bar so I could open the page I want with the SINGLE mouse click (it's a PC after all and not some 7" tablet) and be able to import html, like in any other browser but Opera. Cheers, I love you too. ;)

    What do you think the QAB is? It's the "fricking bookmarks bar BELOW the address bar" that you're wanting. And that is exactly what Pesala was trying to tell you but you simply ignored him. Go back and re-read his instructions.

  • Originally posted by blackbird71:

    Suggestion: Opera seriously needs to get a team working ASAP on a coherent, instantly-accessible instruction/helps/how-to database for new users, broken out by version number, else it risks alienating the very group it seeks to attract. Just sayin'...

    Agree! Agree! Agree! :beer:

  • Originally posted by scratchspace:

    Originally posted by blackbird71:

    I've observed that one of the common elements of quite a number of negative initial postings about Opera's bookmarks situation is that users who first fire up the new Opera are unable to locate or figure out its 'bookmarking' functionality. . . .

    Opera seriously needs to get a team working ASAP on a coherent, instantly-accessible instruction/helps/how-to database for new users, broken out by version number . . .

    Yes, a FAQ/guide of some sort is clearly needed. Unfortunately, the presence of such a FAQ would represent only a speed bump to the fraudulent/trolling "Where are the bookmarks?! I'm shocked! Good riddance, Opera!" posters (e.g., the OP here) who appear with some regularity on this forum.

    Definitely agree that the OP post screams "fraudulent." Especially the whiny and attraction attention "Opera is a lost cause." The post just doesn't smell right.

    I've also seen too many posts by so-called decision makers telling us they're considering Opera for their company, blah, blah blah. Yeah right.:rolleyes:

    Opera could have definitely done a better job documenting the QAB. And it should have been called what it is: bookmark bar. And they should have supplied an easy way to import bookmarks from other browsers, including Presto. The whole point of making it easy to import from others browsers is to get people to easily convert to your browser. Aren't they supposed to try for more business?

  • Originally posted by BernG:

    Originally posted by scratchspace:

    Originally posted by blackbird71:

    I've observed that one of the common elements of quite a number of negative initial postings about Opera's bookmarks situation is that users who first fire up the new Opera are unable to locate or figure out its 'bookmarking' functionality. . . .

    Opera seriously needs to get a team working ASAP on a coherent, instantly-accessible instruction/helps/how-to database for new users, broken out by version number . . .

    Yes, a FAQ/guide of some sort is clearly needed. Unfortunately, the presence of such a FAQ would represent only a speed bump to the fraudulent/trolling "Where are the bookmarks?! I'm shocked! Good riddance, Opera!" posters (e.g., the OP here) who appear with some regularity on this forum.

    Definitely agree that the OP post screams "fraudulent." Especially the whiny and attraction attention "Opera is a lost cause." The post just doesn't smell right.

    I've also seen too many posts by so-called decision makers telling us they're considering Opera for their company, blah, blah blah. Yeah right.:rolleyes:

    But why are these posters doing this? I think one reason is that these posters miss what Opera has lost and they are trying to create as much leverage as they can to get it back. They figure that a simple polite post will be ignored but if they seem more important and angry, the powers that be are more likely to listen to them. I think another reason is that they are simply enraged at the frustration they feel over what they see as dumb decisions made by management. In any case letting these comments stand unanswered is more likely to give management a nudge toward improving Opera. Undercutting these comments doesn't do anybody any good.

  • It is obvious in which Opera thinks that it need to concentrate on customers who can forget that a couple of internet pages imporant of speed face items.

  • Originally posted by blackbird71:

    Opera seriously needs to get a team working ASAP on a coherent, instantly-accessible instruction/helps/how-to database for new users

    Agreed. Good and comprehensive documentation is even more important with the new version than it was with previous versions. The lack of any search results for "Bookmarks" in help is a serious oversight.

    Originally posted by blackbird71:

    Is it any surprise many frustrated users come here and complain?

    No, but it is surprising that someone trained in IT and responsible for installing software for other users would be so useless at finding the relevant information.

    Originally posted by BernG:

    it should have been called what it is: bookmark bar.

    It has already changed back to being called the "Bookmarks bar" in Opera 19.

    Originally posted by bosco30:

    Undercutting these comments doesn't do anybody any good.

    I disagree. The OP may never return to see the comments, but anyone reading the thread can soon see how futile it is to rant and complain, especially when one has one's facts wrong.

    If the OP had politely asked, “Where are the Bookmarks in Opera 18?” we could have told him, and the problem would have been resolved. Even if he decided he really needs an organiser and a menu, not just a toolbar, he would have learnt that they are working on it, and all that frustration would have been avoided right from the start.

  • Originally posted by Pesala:

    Originally posted by blackbird71:

    Opera seriously needs to get a team working ASAP on a coherent, instantly-accessible instruction/helps/how-to database for new users

    Agreed. Good and comprehensive documentation is even more important with the new version than it was with previous versions. The lack of any search results for "Bookmarks" in help is a serious oversight.

    I have come to the conclusion that this is no oversight. It's a logical symptom when they didn't intend to create a functional desktop browser in the first place. The intention was just to ditch Presto and replace it with a parachute Trojan to leave the impression that they still care about the desktop section, whereas in reality it's just a pale extension of the mobile browser. All the signs are in place that there is no development on the desktop browser specifically and this is by design. This is how all the actions make sense, there are no mistakes and oversights, it's going as planned.

  • Originally posted by Pesala:

    Originally posted by alderdale:

    Keep up the good work of embarrassing yourself

    :lol: How did you get a job in IT?

    You should have searched the forum or asked first before embarrassing yourself.

    Instead of importing 4,000 bookmarks to Speed Dial, import them to the Quick Access Bar (aka Bookmarks Bar). That's still rather a lot of bookmarks for the QAB to handle, but as long as they are well organised into folders and subfolders it should work well enough. I have about 1,200 bookmarks in 86 folders/subfolders.

    For "Sessions" the Speed Dial is fine. Stack a number of speed dials on top of each other to create a Speed Dial folder. Right-click on the folder to open them all at once.

    It's not as powerful as sessions were in earlier versions of Opera, but it is a viable solution to open a number of bookmarks at once. Right-click on a folder to open all bookmarks in a folder is another method.

    A Bookmarks Organiser or import/export to other programs is not implemented yet, but D&D on the Quick Access Bar is OK for organising the odd few bookmarks. Right-click and sort alphabetically also helps a lot.

    In many businesses these days ordinary employees are used to test software that is intended as a tool for non technical end user functionality. Browsers fall into that category. I sense that Alderdale is not actually a member of the IT Department (that probably explains why the OP does not actually state that they are a member of the IT Department). The person is likely to be a junior member of staff who belongs to a large group of employees who make extensive use of a web browser in their day to day activity. If I am correct, the investigation that Alderdale conducts will be non technical and concerned more with functionality and ease of use. If Alderdale finds a suitable browser that meets the brief given then a trial will be rolled out to the group for more extensive user testing. The OP has clearly decided already that Opera 18 does not meet the functionality and ease of use requirements of the group. IT Staff are usually accustomed to having to deal with implementation frustrations and finding workarounds and so adopt a more professional approach to their work. Non-technical junior staff find such investigative work confusing and very stressful and perhaps this is why frustration has boiled over into a degree of posting hostility. Obviously my views are an untested hypothesis but I have come across this type of activity many times in my career and the OP displays all of the usual stress symptoms.

    I have chosen to mention this on this Forum in the hope all who contribute to the discussions will adopt a more tolerant and helpful approach.

  • Originally posted by yakyelnats:

    It is clear that Opera feels that it should concentrate on users who need no more that a couple of pages worth of Speed Dial entries - i.e. about 24 icons.¹ Any more than that becomes a pain to handle. I wonder how large a market share that number represents?

    I have 28 on one page including 2 folders with 4 in each, with room for more. According to their user survey of 100,000 users, 90% of users didn't add any bookmarks. I reckon that's sufficient reason not to prioritise bookmarks for the initial release of the browser, though any power user such as those who browse these forums, will obviously use lots of bookmarks.

    ¹ Yes, once you have more than about 24 speed dials, or more than one page, it becomes slow dial.

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