Opera 17 - bookmarks and other troubles

[otleybrock]

otleybrock last edited by

I've just read this thread from start to finish and found it a very depressing experience. Like others I have just installed Opera 17 and wondered what had happened to bookmarks. Having tried the help page, it does not tell me why there are no bookmarks but just that I can import them into Speed Dial. I tried that and confirmed to myself what I had suspected, that it was not an appropriate replacement.
So I searched on Google and this thread came out as the top response, so it is the natural one to follow. Unfortunately what I found, instead of a succinct discussion of the issue and a clear reply is a long dialogue between multiple parties seemingly more intent on picking points out of each other than addressing the question being asked.
As a loyal Opera user since v3 I have put up with the foibles and stayed the path, but right now I am uncertain, as much because of the nature of what I have read as because of the specific failings of v17. Remember, this is the thread that many people with this challenge will be coming to.
Having read the thread all the way through, I think I understand the position but I do have to say Opera has not made it easy.
For example various entries and links make it clear that Opera 17 is still a work in progress, but go to opera.com and you are taken to downloads for Opera 17, no mention anywhere that this is other than a full release product, no mention of bookmarks and no mention that Opera 12 is still available (until you go off into help). Then if you look for bookmarks in help you get the information mentioned above.
As I said, this thread does have buried within it a lot of information about the situation, various options that are available at the moment (Speed Dial & import, Quick Access Bar) plus that Opera have recognised the error and will be providing bookmarks again, at some unspecified point in the future.
I would like to suggest (assuming it can be done) that, given this thread is #1 on Google, it would be really helpful if a succinct but complete summary could be made and pinned at the top of the thread, including an indication of when we might hope to see bookmarks back. This would save a lot of people like myself having to read through the whole thing and see some exchanges which don't help improve Opera's image as a good alternative to the "big boys".
For now I'll be deinstalling 17 and I guess I'll have to work with Firefox to be able to use Evernote web clipping, until Opera gets fixed.

[Deleted User]

Deleted User last edited by

Originally posted by otleybrock:

I would like to suggest (assuming it can be done) that, given this thread is #1 on Google, it would be really helpful if a succinct but complete summary could be made and pinned at the top of the thread, including an indication of when we might hope to see bookmarks back.

This cannot be done for several reasons. First, naturally pretty much everyone has been asking all along if/when bookmarks return (just go take a look at the devs blog). The answers from the devs are various forms of diversion only, beginning with "Ctrl+Z of Ctrl+D" (implying copy-paste implementation of the bookmarks system in Presto, but not saying when) on to "we have something better in mind" on to "we are not giving any details". This applies to all features, not only bookmarks. So, it's been tried.

Second, Google is not making this easy. Different people formulate their problem differently, and different parts of the world get different results. For example, when I search "Opera bookmarks" on Google, the first result is the help page for v.12.10, not this thread. The second result is this thread: BOOKMARKS in Opera 16? - I use 5,000 of them! and the first result outside Opera's websites is Opera 17 Next Is Here, Bookmarks Bar and Sync Still Missing. Looks like the world is already getting to know Opera as the bookmarkless browser. Such a shame, but who to blame?

If you want a succinct summary of the problem/solutions in this thread, then go ahead and do it for this thread. Personally for me, the best solution is to remain with Presto until migration to other programs is complete. This is probably the most repeated suggestion in this thread and others, so why repeat it more? Oh, but I just repeated it...

[frenzie]

frenzie last edited by

Originally posted by ersi:

Second, Google is not making this easy. Different people formulate their problem differently, and different parts of the world get different results. For example, when I search "Opera bookmarks" on Google, the first result is the help page for v.12.10, not this thread. The second result is this thread: BOOKMARKS in Opera 16? - I use 5,000 of them! and the first result outside Opera's websites is Opera 17 Next Is Here, Bookmarks Bar and Sync Still Missing. Looks like the world is already getting to know Opera as the bookmarkless browser. Such a shame, but who to blame?

Same here.

[bussels]

bussels last edited by

It's like the developers forgot what made Opera (up to version 12) unique. To personalize the browser was for me the reason to use Opera. I can still with 12, but I'm afraid I'll have to stick with that. In opera 17 I miss the panels with the notes, bookmarks and downloads on the side. I miss the opportunity to place the tabs on my favorite right side. On a wide screen monitor to get the web pages clearly readable you always have unused space on both sides. In Opera 12 I got an use for it and to use that space efficiently in Opera 17 I see no possibility.

On a tablet of a specific brand I am more or less forced to use safari as a browser, but I can't get used of it. Even as Google Chrome I experienced it as unsettling. Like I said I will be able to use Opera 12, but for how long? Java and flash seemed already been outdated on Opera 12. New and revolutionary developing nowadays seemed to be downgrading to a flashy nothing containing software program. It's sad. It's very very sad.

[bussels]

bussels last edited by

It is not possible to use my favorite search engine as a standard. First I have to add the search engine but then I cannot select it as standard.

[luxor]

luxor last edited by

Originally posted by bussels:

Java and flash seemed already been outdated on Opera 12

Huh? The latest versions of java and flash both work in Opera 12.16 or any other version for that matter.

[handsomechip]

handsomechip last edited by

I tried to access my bookmarks in the middle of the workday, only to discover that they're all gone. I checked the .adr bookmark file, and they're indeed gone. Installed an earlier version 12.x, gone.

If that wasn't bad enough, I come here looking for help and only find entitled, self-righteous tools in every thread I read - providing no help, but still manging to masturbate with insults and the occasional, snarky, insider 'answers' that apparently make sense to the people who are on this forum every day, but not to the regular users of this browser like myself who haven't kept up on the daily workings of this product. Please, forgive us for expecting the bookmarks we need to work like they have for the past umpteen years! And requesting help too? What nerve!

I've used opera since I was a teenager and the browser was still in one of its earliest versions. I've seen the features other browsers boast over Opera, but never felt there was any real compulsion to make the switch. This tears it. It's like stopping in some dying, post-industrial town, and finding only unfriendly xenophobic yokels. It's hard to believe provincial enclaves like this still exist.

[A Former User]

A Former User last edited by

Originally posted by handsomechip:

I come here looking for help

Not a great way to ask for help :down:

Rant in a thread about Opera 17 about a problem in Opera 12.16.

I hope you find the Firefox forums more to your tastes. :bye:

[handsomechip]

handsomechip last edited by

Originally posted by Pesala:

Originally posted by handsomechip:

I come here looking for help

Not a great way to ask for help :down:

Rant in a thread about Opera 17 about a problem in Opera 12.16.

I hope you find the Firefox forums more to your tastes. :bye:

I wasn't talking about a problem with opera 12.16. I also wasn't asking for help: I came here searching threads looking for help, but ran into nothing but you and your fellow basement-dwellers getting your kicks by lording over all the people with bookmark issues. Your utter lack of reading comprehension skills matches your abysmal personality!

[richard042]

richard042 last edited by

I joined just to make this comment to the first two posters. Your arrogance and sarcastic post is far from helpful and is disgusting.

Some kind of help site this is. First,

I DID DO A SEARCH ON GOOGLE AND OPERA,

Do you know what it says wies guys?

Accessing bookmarks
Bookmarks can be accessed from the Bookmarks panel, directly from the Bookmarks menu, or by going to Bookmarks > Manage Bookmarks.

There is no book mark panel. So, before you rank out a person you call a newbie that appears to have some experience with Opera in the past, know your stuff. Stay off the bb if you cant be helpful. The only helpful link on the topic was this forum post. And what is the first thing that is mentioned? Two wise guys telling the original poster to look somewhere else. I sure hope you do not work in IT, I would fire your ass if you worked for me.

After reading the rest of the thread, this is the first and only (so far) place that explains why there are no bookmarks in this Opera. Yes, this is a failure of Opera management. No where did it say it was a beta version for me, so being unfamiliar with Opera I rely on their help pages which are blatantly wrong. Then I come across this fiasco thread. For me, whether or not this question has been answered, in the first two posts, the energy spent ranking out a user who did turn out to be experienced would have been far easier for the poster and the readers that followed.

If you get upset answering questions, please go somewhere else. Don't suggest you are helpful with responses like that.

[A Former User]

A Former User last edited by

Originally posted by richard042:

I joined just to make this comment to the first two posters. Your arrogance and sarcastic post is far from helpful and is disgusting.

Then you violated the TOS by making personal attacks on those two forum members. However, unhelpful you find their posts, your's is even more useless.

The venom misdirected by confused or disgruntled users posting here is the main reason why new members cannot find the information they need. If everyone respected the forum rules and terms of service, it would be easy to find out how to recover your bookmarks in Opera 12.16 or how to import them to Opera 17.

Originally posted by richard042:

there are no bookmarks in this Opera

Disinformation like this only clouds the issue for new users. There are bookmarks in Opera 17, by enabling the Quick Access Bar (aka Bookmarks Bar), and importing your bookmarks from a previous version of Opera.

Originally posted by richard042:

Accessing bookmarks
Bookmarks can be accessed from the Bookmarks panel, directly from the Bookmarks menu, or by going to Bookmarks > Manage Bookmarks.

The information you found with Google is for Opera 12 or earlier, not for Opera 15 or later.

[al-khwarizmi]

al-khwarizmi last edited by

Honestly I think sticklering to forum rules, regardless of whether it's "right" or "wrong" from a moral point of view, is not practical. Dealing with annoyed people (and there are plenty with the new versions of Opera) takes some psychology, it's not very useful to act as if every person in the world was 100% rational at all times because it's just not the case.

Annoyed user comes complaining about bookmarks. Possible answers:

1. Write (or copy-paste) a text about forum rules. Consequence: long flamewar thread ensues (we have seen it a lot of times).

2. Copy-paste a text about the current status of bookmarks. Same amount of work as alternative 1. Consequence: maybe a few posts about how bad that is, but no flamewar because no one will get personally offended by a post.

3. Do nothing. Even less amount of work. Consequence: probably same as 2.

I just don't see any advantage to alternative 1.

[A Former User]

A Former User last edited by

Originally posted by Al-Khwarizmi:

I just don't see any advantage to alternative 1.

I do, which is why I often recommend reading the forum rules, then searching before posting. Users can correct their behaviour and find the help that they need, or have a long flame-war. True, the latter doesn't help the angry user, but the benefit for those who learn to calm down, search, then post, is worth the effort. Some people never learn, but that should not stop everyone from learning.

A strictly moderated forum is best for everyone.

Do nothing is also an option, but then Mr angry poster may stimulate more angry "Me too" posts.

[handsomechip]

handsomechip last edited by

Originally posted by Pesala:

The venom misdirected by confused or disgruntled users posting here is the main reason why new members cannot find the information they need. If everyone respected the forum rules and terms of service, it would be easy to find out how to recover your bookmarks in Opera 12.16 or how to import them to Opera 17.

...you do understand the only reason Richard and I are posting "venom" is IN RESPONSE to the snarky, insulting behavior by you and people like you? That's circular logic. No reading comprehension, no personality, and no critical thinking skills. No wonder you can't help anybody!

No, the main reason this is a mess is the awful way you've handled things. The new versions of opera are causing problems for the users. Searching, the main thing we see is people being flamed or insulted for asking a simple question.

Originally posted by Pesala:

Originally posted by Al-Khwarizmi:

I just don't see any advantage to alternative 1.

Do nothing is also an option, but then Mr angry poster may stimulate more angry "Me too" posts.

You assume just because you do nothing, no one else will either. Ever hear of "if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all"?

Originally posted by Al-Khwarizmi:

Honestly I think sticklering to forum rules, regardless of whether it's "right" or "wrong" from a moral point of view, is not practical. Dealing with annoyed people (and there are plenty with the new versions of Opera) takes some psychology, it's not very useful to act as if every person in the world was 100% rational at all times because it's just not the case.

Annoyed user comes complaining about bookmarks. Possible answers:

1. Write (or copy-paste) a text about forum rules. Consequence: long flamewar thread ensues (we have seen it a lot of times).

2. Copy-paste a text about the current status of bookmarks. Same amount of work as alternative 1. Consequence: maybe a few posts about how bad that is, but no flamewar because no one will get personally offended by a post.

3. Do nothing. Even less amount of work. Consequence: probably same as 2.

I just don't see any advantage to alternative 1.

Not an option. This is apparently their only source of self-esteem in their life. What other reason is there to come and do the same thing over and over again to innocent people, to the same result?

[Deleted User]

Deleted User last edited by

Originally posted by handsomechip:

Ever hear of "if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all"?

Physician, heal thyself! :whistle:

[Deleted User]

Deleted User last edited by

That's odd... it works for me. Are we to assume then that the usual geek crowd who use the Opera browser can't figure out how to do a little research on their own without having to have their hands held? I've admitted to not being nearly as computer literate as many of the complainers of the new Opera browser but even I could figure out how to find the information regarding Opera Next without the necessity of having a "pinned guide" provided by the moderators and/or those responsible for the overall website. I think Pesala's suggestions are very realistic.

[A Former User]

A Former User last edited by

Originally posted by handsomechip:

you do understand the only reason Richard and I are posting "venom" is IN RESPONSE to the snarky, insulting behavior by you and people like you?

The only reason you're posting personal attacks violating the TOS is because you failed to read the rules that you agreed to on signing up, or because you need some help with anger management.

What would have been the result of post 1 by you, if you had found a previous thread on lost bookmarks in 12.16 and fixed the issue yourself, or failing that, posted in that thread to say, “Hi guys, I tried this, but it didn't work for me. What else can I try?” Or, if you had started a new thread asking for help, “I searched for help on lost bookmarks, but couldn't find a relevant thread because I am using an old version, 12.16.”

The fault of Mr Angry Poster is his alone. Other users will respond according to the original post. No one will get insulted or flamed if they don't post insults and flame-bait.

Originally posted by scratchspace:

a strictly moderated forum is best for everyone

It is. This thread would have been locked or removed by the third post. xyzzy80 hasn't even posted again, so the rest is surely a waste of everyone's time and energy, unless Mr Angry Poster has finally learnt that ranting or venting is not the best way to get help on a user2user support forum, or any support forum.

Fact is, xyzzy80 came to rant, not to seek a solution to his problem.

[frenzie]

frenzie last edited by

Originally posted by scratchspace:

That relentless injunction is, in my view, only making a bad situation worse.

Some would call it tone trolling. That being said, the way these one-post wonders are all showing up to badmouth Pesala and leushino smells of unwashed socks.

[Deleted User]

Deleted User last edited by

Alright, you make a reasonable point. There's no question but that Opera handled this entire situation poorly. They released an unfinished browser with relatively little information regarding their plans. In addition the download page makes it difficult to find the latest Presto version and it would be easy for someone looking to upgrade his older version to mistakenly upgrade to the Next version creating all kinds of confusion. I agree... it was pretty slip-shod.

[Deleted User]

Deleted User last edited by

Once again, I find myself agreeing with everything you've said here. It just makes sense. Maybe I need to go lie down. I'm generally not this agreeable.