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Where is the menu bar?

  • Originally posted by Pesala:

    Wasting space with a menu toolbar doesn't make it any faster. In IE you just touch the Alt key to show the menu bar.

    I was talking about toolbar vs. O-button, not hidden toolbar vs. visible toolbar. And of course, a "space wasting" toolbar is faster than a hidden toolbar. Saves you at least one click to unhide it.

  • Originally posted by alexdshields:

    No all users have knowledge of all functions in all software. The menu bar is usually a great place to start for novice users. Having access to a menu bar can also make telephone support a whole heck of a lot easier.

    Agreed, it's the best way to find your way around new software. New users do have access to the menu bar. As soon as they touch the Alt key, the menu is shown at the top left corner. Using the Alt key to show the menus is standard across all Windows applications. It's probably the first thing that anyone would try if not seeing a menu bar at the top. Try old Opera in fullscreen mode with the menu bar enabled in windowed mode. See how easy it is to access the menus without any need for a menu toolbar cluttering the interface.

  • Classic menu bars have common standards that apply across all programs. For example, "Print" is always under "File", "Find" is always under "Edit", and "Zoom" is always under "View", and there is always a "Help" menu which is the last one to the right - this happens not only in Opera 12.x with the menu bar enabled, but in every application that uses menu bars and has those functions.

    This means that (1) you don't have to learn how to perform these standard functions in each program because they can be performed in the same way in every program, and (2) if you use several programs during a session (as most of us do), you don't have to think "now where was the print option in this particular program?" They all have a standard interface so printing something is pretty much unconscious, and therefore immediate.

    This alone is a reason why, for me, the classic menu bar is worth much more than the space it supposedly "wastes". Of course, I respect that other users may not find it useful, and I'm OK with it being optional as it was in Opera 12.x. But yes, many of us want to invest space in a classic menubar, and the reasons are above.

  • In the older versions of Opera, the Preferences form part of the menu.
    But with the newer ones the Menu Bar is dispensed with.
    Clicking on the Big O at the left, top corner will show a drop-down list of items including the "settings" but preferences is missing.
    It is only through the preferences that I can set the font sizes as well as other customisation of Opera.
    So, without this facility, how am I going to do it?
    Thank you.
    Regards,

  • Originally posted by Winston12155:

    In the older versions of Opera, the Preferences form part of the menu.
    But with the newer ones the Menu Bar is dispensed with.
    Clicking on the Big O at the left, top corner will show a drop-down list of items including the "settings" but preferences is missing.
    It is only through the preferences that I can set the font sizes as well as other customisation of Opera.
    So, without this facility, how am I going to do it?
    Thank you.
    Regards,

    Setting IS the preferences. In v16 preferences are minimal but v17 sees a fair bit more added and v18 which should hit the dev channel in a matter of day should restore that even further

    Until then you can run v12 in tandem with the newer versions until it has all the features you need returned

  • Originally posted by Al-Khwarizmi:

    This alone is a reason why, for me, the classic menu bar is worth much more than the space it supposedly "wastes".

    The position of the menu bar is not the problem, but its organisation. The fact that the organisation is different if the menu bar is enabled in old Opera than when it is disabled is really bad design. All we really need is the option to edit the menu.

    Originally posted by Winston12155:

    Clicking on the Big O at the left, top corner will show a drop-down list of items including the "settings" but preferences is missing.

    This is also the case in the old Opera when the menu bar is disabled. This change from "Preferences" to "Settings" was made for the convenience of users of other browsers, not for Opera users. “You can please some of the people ... ” All we really need is the option to edit the menu.

    Other customisation options may return in the New Opera later.

  • The Big "O" button is also almost pointless waste of space on tabs bar.
    At least, Opera 12(or lower) offers the ability to hide it and replace it with a custom toolbar/panel button, mouse gesture, keyboard shortcut or context menu's item. Chropera15+ can't offer any alternative to get rid off this element.

  • Originally posted by Pesala:

    I am not sure why anyone needs to waste space with a menu bar.

    Originally posted by Pesala:

    Wasting space with a menu toolbar doesn't make it any faster.

    Sad sentences....
    +6billion people in the world and you are the right one. Correct? Menu bar its a waste of time and we should all think and be like you, right?
    Next time remember that not all are like you nor have the same needs. Respect!
    What is a waste of time for you its not for other and vice-versa.

    Now, I do find that the lack of menu bar is a big downside.
    Were the hell are the favourites?????

  • Originally posted by djuganight:

    Menu bar its a waste of time

    That's what not I said — it's a waste of space. It doesn't waste any time, but it doesn't save any either. There has been no menu bar on top by default in Opera for many years.

    As long as the menu bar is organised correctly, and doesn't change when moved from displayed at the top to hidden at the side, then it won't take any longer to access the menu items. You may like to have the menu bar at the top, but you're in the minority. An option would be good, but it's not available yet, and clearly not important for most users who would never use it.

    Originally posted by djuganight:

    Were the hell are the favourites?

    How about not wasting our time by searching the forum before posting?

  • Originally posted by Pesala:

    As long as the menu bar is organised correctly, and doesn't change when moved from displayed at the top to hidden at the side, then it won't take any longer to access the menu items.

    Only when you use the keyboard, not when you use the mouse!

    You may like to have the menu bar at the top, but you're in the minority.

    You really know where the majority of users like to have their menu bar? At least this thread gives a different impression.

  • I'm quickly gaining the impression that Opera users are stuck in the 90's. Time to move into the new millennium, mochikun.

  • Originally posted by elrice:

    Originally posted by Winston12155:

    In the older versions of Opera, the Preferences form part of the menu.
    But with the newer ones the Menu Bar is dispensed with.
    Clicking on the Big O at the left, top corner will show a drop-down list of items including the "settings" but preferences is missing.
    It is only through the preferences that I can set the font sizes as well as other customisation of Opera.
    So, without this facility, how am I going to do it?
    Thank you.
    Regards,

    Setting IS the preferences. In v16 preferences are minimal but v17 sees a fair bit more added and v18 which should hit the dev channel in a matter of day should restore that even further

    Until then you can run v12 in tandem with the newer versions until it has all the features you need returned

    So, the newer version is more regressive instead of progressive!!!

  • regressing or progressing where is the FAVOURITES menu?????

  • Use Opera v.12. Okay.

  • You don't know either correct? lololololololo
    But you felt that you should say something although nothing that would help me or others....

    I already downgraded.

  • Originally posted by djuganight:

    You don't know either correct?

    Incorrect. leushino does know, as any regulars here know, but you should have searched before posting. Posting Rule #1.

  • I really don't care if I'm current or not. I went back to v. 12 for the menu bar.

  • What follows is my response to what I consider to be the bullying nature of quite a few comments. I'm sorry this post is so long, but some things need to be said.

    I am new to opera and am thinking of ditching it ... in great part because of the conceit of the posts here.

    foundaustin asks "Where is the menu bar?" This is obviously why their post exists.

    Pesala, et al, if you don't know the answer, or don't believe the question is important, don't add comments that are unhelpful. For all you know the menu may be needed because the person only has one hand! Stop being smug.

    "I am not sure why anyone needs to waste space with a menu bar. It might be useful if the Alt key pulled down the menus at the top like it does in IE, or in fullscreen Opera, but there's really nothing fundamentally wrong with pulling it down at the side instead of the top."

    Your aren't being asked why you don't use the menu, nor asked why it is worth using the menu, or if the menu a waste of space. You aren't even being asked to comment on those who wish to use the menu - "I am not sure why anyone needs to waste space with a menu bar.", but "Where is the Menu?" How does the comment above help?

    "The only time I use the menu is if I cannot remember the shortcut or if I am helping others locate some function. The keyboard is just fine for that — Alt + access keys, or cursor keys. On Opera 11.64, I have fixed my button menu to be the same as the top menu bar."

    How is this helpful? You aren't being asked how you get around Opera, but "Where is the Menu?".

    "Wasting space with a menu toolbar doesn't make it any faster. In IE you just touch the Alt key to show the menu bar." That doesn't help with the question either.

    Mochikun, thanks for the reflection "But maybe it should be the users choice how to use the available space?"

    "... it's the best way to find your way around new software. New users do have access to the menu bar. As soon as they touch ... See how easy it is to access the menus without any need for a menu toolbar cluttering the interface." is condescending. As is to declare "It's probably the first thing ..." I've worked with people using computers for over ten years, most elderly, and the alt key, indeed virtually all keyboard shortcuts, are incomprehensible to them.

    Thank you Al-Khwarizmi for your summary of the usefulness of the classic menu. It shouldn't be necessary to post such here, but the derision, as I read it, of those who either don't know the answer to the question, or are meanly not publishing it, has made your comment necessary.

    Thank you Winston12155 for getting the thread back on track.

    "Setting IS the preferences. In v16 preferences are minimal but v17 sees a fair bit more added and v18 which should hit the dev channel in a matter of day should restore that even further

    Until then you can run v12 in tandem with the newer versions until it has all the features you need returned" is unhelpful; and as far as I can tell, wrong. I have just downloaded Opera from the site ... and Settings isn't, in my world, preferences because it doesn't allow me to set more that the very basic "preferences". Why should I run V12? That is a clumsy way for the coders to have written the version I am using.

    "The position of the menu bar is not the problem, but its organisation. The fact that the organisation is different if the menu bar is enabled in old Opera than when it is disabled is really bad design. All we really need is the option to edit the menu." isn't what has been asked. So, pointless comment!

    "his is also the case in the old Opera when the menu bar is disabled. This change from "Preferences" to "Settings" was made for the convenience of users of other browsers, not for Opera users. “You can please some of the people ... ” All we really need is the option to edit the menu." This too is unhelpful. And, not true. PaleMoon uses TOOLS / OPTIONS!

    "The Big "O" button is also almost pointless waste of space on tabs bar." That's not the point!

    Thank you djuganight. You put my views on what has happened to this thread very well. Again it is sad you have to have written it.

    "That's what not I said — it's a waste of space. It doesn't waste any time, but it doesn't save any either. There has been no menu bar on top by default in Opera for many years.

    As long as the menu bar is organised correctly ... An option would be good, but ... clearly not important for most users who would never use it." Being pedantic is disingenuous. It is a waste of time in that if someone wants to see it it takes "time" to unhide it ... even if only a little time, it is a waste of time. I appreciate you didn't say "time", but it is implied and worth calling you out on.

    "How about not wasting our time by searching the forum before posting?" How about you not wasting our time with your completely self indulgent views that add nothing to solving the problem? I arrived at this pitiful, non helpful meander through grumpy text by those who object to the question, rather than answering it, via a search. The question asked here is exactly my question. The comment "Were the hell are the favourites?" may well be answered elsewhere, but it is relevant here. And, who are you to talk about waste of time?!

    "I'm quickly gaining the impression that Opera users are stuck in the 90's. Time to move into the new millennium, mochikun." What's it to you? You weren't asked for your views of the people who want to have a menu displayed, but "Where is the menu bar?"

    "So, the newer version is more regressive instead of progressive!!!" Great comment. It is sad it had to be posted.

    "regressing or progressing where is the FAVOURITES menu?????" Exactly!!!!

    "Use Opera v.12. Okay." No, it's not OK. And this comment is unhelpful! How dare you!

    "You don't know either correct? lololololololo But you felt that you should say something although nothing that would help me or others...." Well said!

    "Incorrect. leushino does know, as any regulars here know, but you should have searched before posting. Posting Rule #1." There is no indication that leushino knows. So what if all regulars know! Maybe the person did search and this is where they ended up, you don't know. Searching is a real skill and not everyone is good at it. If leushino knows the answer, why isn't it posted as the first comment after the question? Why the need to ridicule and bully?

    Finally, Pesala ... if screen space is so limited on your screen that you need to not give up space to a Menu, get a bigger one.

  • Where is the "Show menu bar" on Opera 17 ?

    Where is File Edit View Bookmarks Tool and Help
    displayed at the top like in Opera 12.13
    show in this screen shot?-

    How can I get this display ?

    "Alt" doesn't display this.

    Thanks

  • If current means that they get rid of menu bar ? So it is.

    Originally posted by shlalaw1:

    I really don't care if I'm current or not. I went back to v. 12 for the menu bar.

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